Ninety percent of small businesses fail within the first two years. With few exceptions, working for free is the fastest way for freelance photographers to become part of this 90 percent.
Here are a few excuses I’ve heard for working for free, along with my responses:
- I’m trying to get into concert photography, so when bands have called to ask about pricing, I’ve told them, “It’s on me.” It’s a great way for me to break into that market.
- I just did a free shoot for a young actress trying to make ends meet, like many starving artists. It helped her and was an opportunity for me to practice my lighting techniques.
- I offered to shoot free family photos for all my neighbors for their holiday cards. It’s a good way to promote my business.
- I got some valuable event-photography experience shooting one of my company’s employee celebrations for free. I got to shoot an event for a Fortune 500 corporation, and my pictures received excellent exposure on the company Web site, with over 25,000 hits. I was even given a free photo printer for my effort.
- Every photography job I’ve ever gotten has been through word of mouth — often because I did something for free first.
- I’ve been doing some free portraits of friends for fun, to use as their Facebook profile photos. When people see my pictures on Facebook, I’ll expand my network and it can lead to jobs.
- I like my day job in IT, but at night I am passionate about photography. I don’t mind self-funding my work because it gives me more creative freedom.
- I’m a young amateur photographer, close to graduating from college, so I’m focusing on building a portfolio I can be proud of. Money? Later.
- I did some high-profile assignments for free, and now I’m published in major magazines with a photo credit.
- I recently graduated from photography school and have been shooting like crazy, mostly for free. I’ve been getting very good experience. I’m also making contacts, and once the economy improves, I’ll be in a much better place than had I sat around waiting for paid assignments.
- It’s different now because of digital photography. Ten years ago, shooting for free meant eating the cost of film, processing and Polaroids unless the client paid your costs. Today, all a free shoot costs you is your time. Pixels are free!
- Once I stopped worrying about charging for shoots, I have had offers and requests coming at me from all directions. I want my photographs to benefit the world and to help other people. It’s not about the money.
It’s a great way to break into that market known as “free.” How many times do you think musicians have screwed themselves over and given away the farm to music labels? Too many to count. Don’t make the same mistake.
Romanticizing being a “starving artist” isn’t really a good thing. It’s nice when you’re sipping a chai tea latte with your beret in the local java house listening to beatniks recite their slam poetry, but other than that, it’s mostly a good way to remain starving. Doing a trade-for-prints/trade-for-CD deal is for C-grade models and photographers who almost never become pros. And while you may think that it helps you with your lighting techniques, it doesn’t help you grow in the area that matters most — the confidence to know that your work has value.
It’s nice to be a good neighbor. Then again, you might soon be getting lots of invitations to weddings and Bar Mitzvahs, with the suggestion: “Hey, why don’t you bring your camera? We’d love to have some photos, and you would really be saving us some money.” So now, you’re an even better neighbor than you intended to be — and you’ve knocked some local wedding photographer out of a paying gig. Or, if you respond with, “Oh, those holiday photos were a one-time thing; I charge to shoot events,” you’ll probably get something like this: “Come on, neighbor, you’re going to be there anyway!”
A free photo printer? You mean one of the dozen printers your company got for free when they ordered the last batch of CPU’s from Dell or HP? As someone who has shot for over half of the Fortune 500, I can tell you that I’ve earned $1,000 or more per assignment shooting company picnics, holiday parties, and so forth. It’s not glamourous, but it helps pay the bills. That is, unless you have someone willing to do it for a free printer. By the way, who insured your personal gear against spilled sodas or any other accidents? Let me guess: no one.
Right, word of mouth. As in, “Hey, I know this photographer who will shoot for free…” Congratulations! You’ve just become known all over town as the guy who doesn’t expect to be paid for his work. Maybe if you’re lucky, you’ll even get a client who offers to buy you lunch.
No, it will lead to more requests to take pictures “for fun” — from friends, then friends of friends, then people who just don’t want to pay to have their portraits taken. And you’ll be making lots of new friends among the professional portrait photographers whose livelihoods you are damaging. Happy networking!
Guess what, IT guy? When India’s night work takes over your day job, don’t call me crying about it. Also, don’t bother trying to make a living from your “passion,” because you’re already doing all you can to undermine your chances — as well as everyone else’s.
Excellent. One more student photographer who doesn’t care about money. I predict that when Sallie Mae comes a callin’ for payback on those loans that funded your education, money will become much more important to you. And I assume you’ll have things like rent, food and clothing to worry about, too. Unless Mommy and Daddy are still paying for everything — which is really nothing for you to be bragging about.
“Will work for photo credit” is one of the more asinine mentalities among photographers today. You’re helping no one, including yourself. All you’re doing is killing editorial opportunities for others.
That’s some photography school — where you didn’t get experience! Your problem is that you just want to shoot pictures rather than earn assignments. You don’t “sit around waiting” for work; you market yourself to people who are willing to pay for your services. Those contacts you’re making are worth about as much as your photography is worth to them.
No, actually, pixels are not free — but thanks for playing. Cameras and camera shutters have a lifespan of a few hundred thousand frames. Divide the number of frames you shot for free by the cost of the camera, and you’ll begin to get a sense of how much that shoot cost you. That doesn’t count the cost of Photoshop for post-production, storage of the raw files, burning them to CD for your clients, and on and on.
Of course you have “offers and requests” coming at you from all directions. So does the drunk girl at the club who hops on the slippery oak bar-top with a short skirt and no underwear and says, “If you see anything you like, I’ll be in the back offering it for free.” You’re surprised that a line forms immediately? So, you want to “help other people.” How about helping those who earn a living producing photographs by not undercutting them? That’s the best way to ensure that great photography continues to benefit the world.
July 13th, 2010 at 12:25 am
AMEN!
July 13th, 2010 at 12:43 am
So, what do you suggest a photographer to do when they're just starting out and have very little experience? Charge no matter what (even though you're not a "Pro" yet)?. It's kind of a catch 22 situation.
July 13th, 2010 at 1:17 am
Great post, nothing to add. Just mentioned it as "mustread" on my website. Thanks a lot!
July 13th, 2010 at 4:13 am
I posted a link to this on my Facebook page that's getting some interesting reaction. http://www.facebook.com/home.php#!/craigferguson?v=wall&story_fbid=131693366866972&ref=notif
July 13th, 2010 at 4:55 am
Brilliant! About time someone told it as it really is.
July 13th, 2010 at 5:28 am
Mate, get over yourself. That's quite a bit of tension....
How many teenagers with a camera undercut you to make you sooooooooo warm and fluffy?
I did my first ever wedding for free 3 years ago. Exactly for the reason of helping a neighbour and to get see if I could do a wedding. I started charging from the second wedding and now make a very healthy profit for each wedding. I'm already fully booked for next summer.
Shoot for free? Hell yes!
Have the business acumen to not let people take the piss so you can make a profit? Hell yes!
Bitch and moan because people are doing differently then you used to and now you feel undervalued? Get lost....
July 13th, 2010 at 5:36 am
Brilliant! so how do you think people would pay me for wedding photography if I have no pics of weding yet? maybe I'll have to wait till my sister get married? come on! just common sense. I don't think it's a bad idea to build a portfolio with some free shoots...
July 13th, 2010 at 6:24 am
There is no catch 22 at all, you offer a service and you charge for it, if your a student you already have a portfolio, or did you not do anythign at College/University, people employ you because they like your style of photography, simple.
if we start to do things for free surley we are just drilliung down our prices, plus if i wount do it for free... it looks like someone will, this wil kill the art form and industry.
July 13th, 2010 at 8:18 am
While I agree with majority of your rants... I have to say that I was one of these so-called "free hire" photographers. But it did help me develop my business. Though it currently may not be as lucrative as your business, what are your thoughts on 2nd shooting a wedding for free to build up a wedding portfolio? Not too many people trust you can shoot such a momentous occasion without a portfolio to back it up. Or what about interning? Is that what you would a crime against the vast community of pro photographers? I will admit, I've been burned before but progressively I've been learning how to market myself, price myself and build up a chunk of contacts who in the end have eventually come back for paying gigs. I don't mean to come off brash, just thinking it's a broad spectrum. I did enjoy your post. Creative sarcasm... Gotta love it.
July 13th, 2010 at 8:35 am
Nice, John. I've done a ton of TFP shoots, and I've been finding them to be increasingly frustrating. Like you said, it's definitely not a professional environment. I really need to step off of that treadmill, because it's taking me nowhere.
And it's funny...I did a cheapo engagement shoot a couple of years ago, and I knocked the client's socks off. What did it get me? A recommendation on a wedding website -- that I did a great job for next to nothing. Rather than snagging somebody looking for high quality work and attention to detail, I got inquiries from bottom feeding bargain hunters. Definitely not my ideal demographic.
Thanks for the reminder.
July 13th, 2010 at 8:37 am
I disagree with so many of these excuses. You have to start Somewhere and yes, believe it or not, FREE can 100% build a hugely successful business! Trust me!!
http://ForWeddingPhotographers.com
Inspiring Photographers Everywhere
by Louis Torres
New York based Destination Wedding Photographer
July 13th, 2010 at 9:24 am
What now new photog all think like farmers in my country (China)?
July 13th, 2010 at 10:44 am
One of the problems with noobs shooting for free is that no professional shooters offer any kind of help to a noob that shoots for free.
Most noobs run in circles where professionals are around but none of those professionals want to take time to guide or mentor a noob. If one professional took one noob aside and said, "Look, here's a basic list of what to charge for this and that," then noobs would feel more comfortable charging a rate that is comparable to their skill level and in turn, that initial noob could turn around and help other noobs.
We are not asking for your trade secrets, your client lists, your favorite Lightroom Presets or Photoshop Actions. We simply want and need guidance.
If you are so professional, then act like it and give something back.
July 13th, 2010 at 10:47 am
Just saw this on ASMP: "The Best Way To Compete With Amateurs Is... DON'T!"
http://www.asmp.org/strictlybusiness/2010/07/the-best-way-to-compete-with-amateurs-is%E2%80%A6-don%E2%80%99t/
July 13th, 2010 at 10:52 am
I'm going to have to say that while I agree that most of these don't make good business practices, they can lead to exposure and paying jobs. I've only shot one commercial assignment for free and it's lead to 5 -- well paying jobs.
I shot one wedding for free, and it's lead to more than 20 paying weddings in a little over a year.
I think that people need to realize that they have to start somewhere because most people won't pay you if they can't see what kind of work you can do and simply saying "I can take great photos" just won't cut it. I learned that one the hard way.
I also want to say that shooting for free with an understanding is a lot better than cheap. As an example, if you shoot one or two things of different types for free to build a portfolio, is different than shooting a wedding which should be $1,200 for $300. That damages the market place more, especially if you're any good at shooting because then that couple will tell another couple that they got an incredible deal, and in turn you've set the entire region to a new low.
Also, shooting for free for a non-profit can be a good thing... and... nobody said that whomever you shoot for free gets free prints or CDs. That's crazy talk.
July 13th, 2010 at 11:12 am
All depends who you're doing it for. I would never charge friends for work, that's just rude.
July 13th, 2010 at 11:23 am
I agree that after a certain point there's a need to charge for your work, but I think it's not a bad thing to build your portfolio when you're first starting out. Especially if all you've had are a couple college beginner's classes. I don't think that B&W photo of a rose or the graffiti on the wall is going to sell your mad skillz in the beginning. Just sayin. And here's the thing - it's most likely not stealing business away from the pro as you seem to so avidly believe. The person who asks you to shoot for free/comission/exposure wasn't going to hire a pro to begin with. They'll find someone else with a crappy P&S to get the snapshots they wanted and then go print them at Wal-mart.
July 13th, 2010 at 11:35 am
They're all good points, and a decent amount of humor thrown in ... but. You should have said once at the beginning of the post that doing free work hurts other photographers trying to make a living. By adding it as a little comment on several of your points, you come off as sounding awfully bitter.
Would I shoot for free, absolutely, but not that I'm trying to make a career out of it. Odd's are I'm going to screw up, I would tell somebody that up front. "Sure I'll take some pictures for free, but I'm likely to f*** something up so if it's at all important to you, you might want to hire somebody else to be there who knows what they're doing"
July 13th, 2010 at 11:38 am
It's all well and good stating that you shouldn't shoot for free, but how is someone supposed to get experience/portfolio without starting somewhere.
I personally stand by that you shouldn't charge less than what you're worth, either charge full price or do it for free. As long as the reason it's free is agreed to upfront then you shouldn't have any problems down the road.
Whilst you argue it isn't, it is actually a fantastic way to network and gain confidence in the field of photography you want to go into.
Only last week I shot a conference having had no experience shooting conference's at all. As there was no price involved, there was no pressure on me so I was able to fully investigate conference photography and what I should be looking out for. It's a great way to learn. It's actually now led to some paid work due to the good job I did. Would the paid work have come about if I hadn't have worked for free? No of course not. I met lots of people there, was able to network and gain contacts and I'd now be fully confident in charging for event/conference photography.
I think a one-time free shoot in whichever genre you're looking to get into is the ideal way to be able to move into chraging. You'll have encountered all the pitfalls, and it'll be clear to your client that you're doing it for free for the experience.
July 13th, 2010 at 11:39 am
No. 10 was a little ambiguous. Nothing wrong with shooting self-assigned stock as long as you're not giving away usage.
July 13th, 2010 at 12:11 pm
Hi.
To answer your question, Yes. You should charge no matter what. Now, what changes is how much you should charge. Obviously, if a real PRO is charging $3000.00 for a wedding, you can't. Charge accordingly to your experience. It may be very little money at first, but it sets the sense of: "I paid to get my photos taken"...they won't htink of you as the free photographer.
July 13th, 2010 at 2:43 pm
I gotta say, I'm pretty disappointed that Black Star would even publish this article. I guess link bait is good for traffic, no matter if people are linking to it because it's great or because it's trolling junk.
To all you photographers that might just be starting out and don't know how to prove you're capable of producing good photos, feel free to give one or two away. Even if you're not just starting out, maybe you're just thinking about trying something new, maybe adding a specific service or targeting a different niche, free is a great price to give someone that is taking a chance with you.
July 13th, 2010 at 3:34 pm
I am not a pro photographer but have been guilty of "free" photography in the past. The problem is that you set the expectation that it will always be free. I no longer accept requests to do free photos for friends. If I am asked, I will decline unless there is some sort of trade or mutual benefit; I don't count "experience" or "content for a portfolio" as a benefit. Movie studios, grocery stores and mechanics don't give stuff away so they can get more "experience."
Like those to do photography for a living, I also spend money on equipment. Why would you take on the expense of equipment so others can benefit from your work? When your camera dies, no one is going to step forward to buy you a new one. Set a price, have confidence in your skills, and don't lower the value of the service you provide.
July 13th, 2010 at 5:03 pm
I gotta go with the haters on this one, sorry. Not because I believe people should work for free, but because every situation is different. I believe there are situations at every level of one's career where shooting for free might be appropriate. Where would my personal projects be if all the cast and crew took this same approach with me? When you give a little, you get more in return. Those who love shooting will work on projects that have little or no budget for a variety of reasons, just like models and stylists will do the same when we can only give them lunch for a portfolio shoot. Discriminating between opportunity and being taken advantage of is not an easy skill but gets easier with practice and CAN reap paid rewards in the end.
July 13th, 2010 at 11:30 pm
It's one thing to work for a freind for free, I.E. a budget wedding or portraits but it's another to work for free for a for profit organization.
July 14th, 2010 at 8:01 am
There is no value is working for free. The problem is that these days everyone is in a rush to be a photographer and nobody wants to go through the assisting route any more. How do you build your portfolio without shooting for free and at the same time learn the ins & outs of the business, you assist a working pro who has a healthy business doing the kind of photography you want to do.
All of my work, all of it for at least the first four years of doing photography on my own came from the photographers I assisted for. I took on the jobs they didn't want to do and put my all into each time trying to win that client over. As photographers move up the quality of assignment ladder they will pass off work they used to do assistants and that's your chance to build your portfolio. Why will the client hire you? Because the photographer who they trust vouched for you and they know you from his sets, they know you were his assistant and that you've practically done the job yourself before anyways.
If you want to shoot weddings, assist a wedding photographer.You will learn 10x what you would have then if you jump straight into the fire and you'll have the chance to do it without getting burnt.
I allow all my assistants to shoot with my equipment in my studio when it's not in use. I help them to hire equipment when they have a shoot of their own and I also allow them to put the work we did together in the back of their portfolios. I'll pass on work when it's no longer of interest of finatial necessity for me to shoot it and in doing all of this I'm just repeating what the photographers who I assisted for did for me.
Working for free for a couple of assignments doesn't get you to jump in front of the line. It damages your chances of running a successful business and it trains those who follow you to try and get work by undercutting and doing it for free rather than thinking long term about a sustainable business.
My business has been damaged by the work for free mentality in a very real way. For several years I was (one of?) Tokyo's only working (paid) live music photographers. I was able to shoot on average two to three bands a night and was making $250/band plus 50% of the licensing revenue. Shooting two bands a night, three nights a week was a very healthy business but sure enough every time I shot there were more and more "shooting for free to build my portfolio" kids with their new DSLR snapping away at everything that moved. At first I found them a slight annoyance, filling up the pit and cutting back on my ability to shoot while minimizing my presence to the audience (something I always kept in mind as my access was the promoter and keeping the promoters happy was the lifeline to keep my business running). With the non professionals moving in and offering free prints to mags and promoters for the chance to shoot their favorite bands and the promoters stupidly going for it the pit became more and more of a jumbled mess. Conflict between photographers and between photographers and the audience started to develop and this of course worried the promoters who in tern cut back access, for everyone. Of course by this stage the promoters want to kick out all the ametures but they have also gotten used to getting images for free, its now the promoters right if you want access and the budget they used to have is gone and not coming back. I've since moved on but I lost a great business, and live music photography is slowly becoming more and more sterile as the numbers of pros who really get it are progressively being pushed out of the busiess.
July 14th, 2010 at 8:24 am
Nathan, you will just have to adapt, that's the nature of all business. I used to hand paint huge backlit banner adverts that you see at airports & railway stations, then they started making huge printers that could do it in a fraction of the time & cost with no real level of skill involved. That whole business I was involved in is now consigned to history. No point being stagnant and bitching about it, move with the times & technology and seek different opportunities, or end up like the dinosaurs. What I'm hearing from a lot of photographers these days is similar to what was coming from the old school printers when DTP started to take over. Things change, not always for the best. You'll just have to rely on your captures being better than the competitions.
July 14th, 2010 at 9:11 am
Being open to adaptation is part of the business for sure but it doesn't change the reality that shooting for free isn't healthy for photography. Doing something once doesn't mean that you are capable and experienced enough to do it professionally and I really don't understand the philosophy behind that particular line of thinking.
"Photographers" shooting for free isn't going to kill photography all together but it is slowly picking off parts of the industry and it's the parts of the industry where you would typically get your first breaks. In reality killing off the first stepping stone to a viable photography business is kind of good for me (in a selfish way) as the next generation of photographers are going to have a much harder time getting to the good assignments with production value.
Fortunately for me I've been through the assiting path and have eight plus years of seeing the inside of other photographers businesses to help me adapt and read where I need to be in three years time.
July 14th, 2010 at 9:13 am
Oh hey sinister...fancy seeing you here!
I knew from the start the whole, don't do freebies thing, but where are the guides on how to actually get someone to pay for work! Especially music photography. It appears to me there are probably only a dozen or so music photographers who do get paid in the whole UK!
July 14th, 2010 at 9:28 am
Nathan, you are quite right it won't kill photography, but undoubtably will change it. I agree that people shouldn't work for profit making organisations for nothing, my main point was regarding those who say they wouldn't even work for friends for free. I have in the past worked for no cash but on a sort of exchange for services/goods I need/use, that can work out very well at times.
July 14th, 2010 at 9:53 am
Bartering is a totally different situation to working for free. Two years ago did a shoot for a kids clothing company in exchange free clothes for my girls ( 4 & 2 ). Over the last two years the girls have received close to $6,000 worth of clothing so essetially I did the job for $6,000, approximately twice what I would have received if I had of taken payment in cash. That wasn't I job I did for free.
@ Felton. Is it up to professional photographers to chase down "noobs" and teach them the law of the land or should "noobs" overcome their intimidation and approach professionals for some help? Any one trying to run a photography business is flat out busy and while I am willing to help anyone who walks into the studio looking for advise I can't go running around every gig I shoot making sure all the "noobs" are getting the advice they need.
July 14th, 2010 at 11:00 am
Tracy, why not contact one of the more successful music photographers and find out? Danny Clifford is incredibly approachable and runs his own blog about his exploits shooting musicians, live and otherwise.
Like all photography businesses you need to access whether it's viable or not and to do that you can't take a shoot pictures first, figure out where to sell them later attitude.
Think about who consumes music photography and who supplies it, where is demand not being met or where can you do a better job than those already in the market (while still remaining profitable). For a while, being in Japan, I had better access and a good chance of getting backstage or behind the scenes portraits to differentiate myself from the Stateside or UK based photographers. I was also able to sell myself to promoters as I also had the advantage of being able to freely and easily communicate with the bands (being that most Japanese photographers had limited English ability) and even more importantly I could read the bands non verbal communication (if I was welcome or not). I was able to turn those two factors into enough of an edge to make a go of it (while it lasted).
July 14th, 2010 at 11:19 am
Please, the "free photographers killed my business" excuse? The industry is changing, you can either change with it or peace out. Don't worry, there will be 10 photographers to replace you when you're gone.
In addition to my earlier comment- doing a shoot for free means you can control the expectations of the client. You can tell them what the boundaries are, and what they should expect of you. When they aren't paying anything they don't want to overstep those boundaries because there's a chance that they'll annoy you to the point that you get pissed. Nobody wants their photographer to be pissed at them. Not to mention, they are usually thankful for any work that they can get out of you for FREE.
This is why FREE is a better option than charging cheap. People who are paying you have the same expectations no matter what they are paying. The person that is giving you $100 for a shoot feels just as entitled as the person who gave you $10,000 the day before for the same thing.
To reiterate- I'm not advocating following a band around for their entire tour and shooting for nothing. I'm not advocating to shoot a season of weddings for nothing. I'm not advocating doing the Class of 2011's senior portraits for nothing. But one or two weddings/shows/portraits, just to get your portfolio started, whether you are new to the business or branching out, is a great way for you to learn, and a great way to show others that you're capable of producing the desired results.
July 14th, 2010 at 11:46 am
In case it was misunderstood, I have adapted and I'm still in business.
Other photographers shooting for free had a negative impact on my ability to run a profitable live music photography business in more subtle ways than just reducing the value of photography. When promoters started letting photographers who would shoot and supply images for free they started letting in more and more new faces, not the same photographers shooting for free all the time but the nest new kid offering free images and as a direct result of that policy you had more and more photographers in a situation without the experience to deal with it properly. In the end it wasn't the "free" that broke the system it was the inexperienced and poor handling of the situation by all involved.
I think photographers who think that if they don't charge for their work they have no responsibility for the outcome of your actions have the wrong idea about this profession. Doing something for free in order to lower the expectations of the client just sounds completely immature and unprofessional to me.
My position remains that instead of doing one or two weddings for free and starting out from there that you would be better placed to run a good business if you spend two to three months assisting the top rated wedding photographer in your city. During this time you will shoot images of your own, you will get work in your book and you'll be better placed to do good work that lives upto everyones expectations (and of you don't get to go work for someone else).
As for the ten photographers waiting to replace me, don't make me laugh. Having a camera is not being a photographer, it's everything you do without the camera in your hand that's really important.
July 14th, 2010 at 12:37 pm
Show me a pro that will share pricing guidelines with me and I'll roll with it.
Show me a pro that will not grunt at me for being in the same room as him and I'll assist him, to gain experience. (I'll charge him of course)
Show me a client that will pay me to do an assignment with no portfolio or experience and I'll snatch their hand off.
I won't be going down the intern route, after all, we should be charging what we are worth, surely?
I sympathize with the way the digital age has undermined the industry, the problem is, in my experience, pros only sympathize with themselves, so us amateurs' have to fend for ourselves to get to the level where we can charge an appropriate fee or even get paid assignments.
Don't forget, you were all 'noobs' once.
Your post only alienates you and your colleagues even further.
July 14th, 2010 at 1:12 pm
This is hilarious.
Nothing of value in this article. It's just a disgruntled, old, curmudgeon who can't compete, and is trying to 'educate' everyone else on how not to get in his way. You can't keep up anymore, so instead of working harder, you demand everyone else runs slower.
If you were any good at what you did, your results would speak for themselves, and you'd have no trouble getting paying clients.
Imagine a chef complaining that people are using their own stoves and inviting friends and relatives over for dinner. They even have the nerve to cook for free!
July 14th, 2010 at 1:43 pm
Wow, makes me wonder just how "good" you are for you to be worried about these "asinine" "passionate" "IT" guys with cameras.
If you're getting undercut by these guys, maybe it's YOU that needs to re-evaluate how YOU do things.
Having now seen your work, I know why you're worried. Get the chip off your shoulder, work on ways of being better (instead of sitting on your laurels) and you'll not have to worry about us taking your job mate.
Less time bitching, more time working on creativity.
July 14th, 2010 at 4:03 pm
Stymied is the word I'm looking for. As in, "I'm stymied by some of the responses here."
It doesn't come down to whether or not I agree or disagree with the concept of working for free. I don't. But opinions are like certain parts of the human anatomy. We've all got 'em.
But the complete lack of logic inspires a sense of fear in me.
If you went to school/college and didn't come out with a portfolio, you screwed the pooch royally. Time to get a job and make some money while developing your skill.
If you want to build a portfolio, sure, shoot for free - for yourself. Silver does not cross my palm every time I pick up a camera. When I do a personal project, I don't give it away. If somebody wants to buy something later, or I want to move it into my stock portfolio, then great. Say it with me - you don't need an assignment to make pictures.
Most of the people I know have portfolios largely comprised of self-directed projects instead of assignment work. It's often funded out of their own pockets. But they're sure not giving the photos away to magazines or corporations.
Don't take assignments for free, and don't hand out pictures for free. Shoot whatever you want, but make others pay to use/have it. If they don't, well, keep trying, or get out of the way.
Other ways of getting experience? Assisting a real, actual professional. The university I went to (and the same seems to be true of most) offered very little in terms of business management for artists. I got my experience and some portfolio-building done working as an assistant to regional and national photographers while in school and after.
Wanna learn about lighting? Working with someone who's been doing this for a lifetime is a great way to start. It's a lot faster than trying to figure it out yourself without the right tools.
Practically everyone I ever assisted would let me play in the studio. Getting paid to learn is a pretty good deal in any field.
I would still take an assistant job with some photographers today if it was a great opportunity to work with someone whose work I really admire.
The sheer lack of understanding of market economics is disappointing too. Some said, "might as well do it for free because someone else will."
That part, at least others being willing, is true. For every shooter out there, paid or volunteering, there are 10 or more in line to do it cheaper or free.
So they work themselves out of a job and someone else steps in.
Why bother trying to compete on that level? That game cannot be won. It just can't.
Rather than trying to sell the same stuff in a crowded market, create a different product (not limited to "better" or "different") and create a new market.
The game of life is not easy. This business is not easy, and for better or worse, we don't always win.
July 14th, 2010 at 4:50 pm
Hmmm... my .02 is varied. I agree with your business savvy (in general). I think that some people are getting the chip-on-the-shoulder idea because of your sarcastic "wit" (which isn't very funny to me, but hey...whatdoIknow?)
However, you're being foolish if you think a new, professional can break into the market without giving something away. Maybe you've been around so long you no longer have to worry about new clients. But, those who are trying to become established can't build their business without offering a client or two a deal. And "free" gets a client's attention more than anything else. I disagree with *totally* free, though. Maybe the (as in SINGLE, ONE) sitting/session for free, then charge for the photos.
Since someone talked about ignorance... IMO, your ignorance is in assuming that one freebie defines a photographer's career.
July 14th, 2010 at 9:36 pm
If you're of the opinion that the free model truly works, you're not going to have your mind changed by an article.
No worries, just do yourself a favor- measure your results. Track all of your time and expenses and run the numbers- did "free" lead directly to pay and what were the results of the paying gigs. What was the hourly profit?
Either later or even at the same time, take the sage advice from the naysayers (who also seem to be the only folks making a living at the craft) and assist, intern, barter or shoot for yourself. Run the same numbers, time, expenses, what jobs came from this and what your hourly profit was.
Don't guess- measure. And then come on over to the dark side.
Our experience is that free begets free and in eight years, we've only tracked one job back to gutter credit in a magazine, which came from a lawyer, probably the only demographic that actually reads fine print. {grin}
As for the assumption that working for free puts you in control, heh heh heh, too funny. In the absence of money, you are now trading on your reputation, which is a lot more valuable.
I don't agree with John's "for the industry" approach, too late, the industry is already gone. What I mean by this is that there is no "industry price scale".
Price has no meaning, you can find free, cheap, medium and expensive in spades, as opposed to say, landscaping, where seven companies quoted us all within a 20% spread. That's an "industry rate".
It's too late and the genie doesn't go back in the bottle. Just do it for yourself. Get paid, feel better.
July 14th, 2010 at 9:41 pm
Wasn't too long ago that I contacted (via their website) the organizers of a local event. I was seeking to be hired as a photographer.
The lady who wrote back edits a local magazine. And I know for a fact that their printer and other vendors get paid.
So, I was a little taken aback when she said that this event had no budget for photography. I've heard that there's some big bucks sponsorship behind it, so where's this no budget stuff coming from?
Oh, she added that I was welcome to volunteer as a photographer. My response: "Sorry, can't afford to work for free."
I haven't heard a word from anyone associated with that event since.
July 14th, 2010 at 9:58 pm
Some wise words... thank you !
July 14th, 2010 at 10:23 pm
OK, my two and half cents on this thought.
I think, like most others on here, that shooting for free in certain instances can lead to bettering yourself and your work. I have a photo shoot for TFP upcoming, only because my first shoot that I paid for (albeit as a donation to a charity for the model) turned out amazing. The shoot that is coming up is with an inexperienced model and will benefit her portfolio, and quite possibly mine. Yes I am also shooting a wedding soon, at no cost, for my niece. Now, with that being said, I have to say this, will I continue to shoot for free? Absolutely not! I will at times, when it benefits me and the model/client, but sometimes it allows you to network with others, it allows them to see your quality and work ethic, those are the two important things, not how much you charge. If your quality is good and your work ethic sucks, you will never get anywhere in this business. I have a quote, my own;
"Quantity does not overshadow Quality,
Quality should always come first.
Without quality the customer leaves." John S.
As long as the quality and the work ethic show you as an amazing photographer, you will be able to set your standards, name your price for your work. Not some other photographers work. If asked do you shoot like so and so, or can you give me pictures like so and so, simply state no, I can give you my quality and my photos, if you want their work go speak to them.
@Felton, @Nathan, @Will, @Frederick, I am going to school come this October for photography. I made sure the school adhered to MY standards of what I want to learn for classes. Of which, I will have to create a portfolio of work AND have it reviewed, as well as spend 200 hours as an apprentice with a professional photographer of MY choosing. I haven't decided on whether or not to do Fashion or Weddings yet. They also offer a full semester of business classes. Yes, I HIGHLY agree that professional photographers could help those who are truly wanting to learn and get into this business, but I think that it falls to most being scared of loosing business to those the train and protege. It's the old 80's adage, "If we train you to do this job, you will take that training and go to work for someone else making more money"
Doesn't work that way anymore. My blog is about the promotion of others, and helping others to learn in this business, while at the same time learning myself. Help the up and coming photographers, you won't be around forever. Pass that legacy on to others.
July 14th, 2010 at 10:39 pm
If you are in the U.S. join some photography groups via Meetup.com. That is what I did in early 2009. Back then, I had never once taken my flash off camera. Via those groups I learned how to make portraits, work with amateur to low-level pro models, and met real pro photographer contacts who let me second shoot with them on weddings. Now just a year later I run my own photography business and shoot weddings with confidence. So that is how you can go from limited experience to paid work without having to do free jobs in between (though I volunteered once for my local Chamber of Commerce).
July 14th, 2010 at 11:13 pm
Have respect for yourself and for the industry. Simple as that. If you allow yourself to be low-balled and not paid with what you're worth go ahead. Might as well sell yourself on the streets with placards as well.
July 15th, 2010 at 12:24 am
The analogy in #1 should be to bands playing gigs for free (or effectively free) when they first started out which if you asked around, I'm sure you'd find is very true.
If a professional photographer cannot show the distinction between their work and someone offering services free of charge then that's exactly the problem. If you don't like competing with "free" photographers then work to put yourself in another category (in terms of skill & style).
July 15th, 2010 at 1:09 am
shooting for free makes absolutely no sense... but anyway a shoot for free can lead you to the right direction... taking into account that you can sell the photo earlier or later. during my studies i took a photo, round about 15 years ago... sold it just recently to a media agency ...
July 15th, 2010 at 1:15 am
I love that this topic is so controversial! Jeff - the band analogy is perfect. Do musicians get paid to practise? Artists paid to sketch? Many unpaid 'gigs' can be sketches for your future pictures. I am a big believer that photographers pictures 'approach zero' in that we tend to take our favorite pictures and reincarnated them. This is a good thing and why our portfolios are so important in booking jobs. The more we work on our internal image the better we become.
Also - I'm sure this will be controversial too - I always ask new assistants who write to me wanting to assist if they would donate their time first on a test shoot or two. I am always surprised at how many decline. The few who accept - and actually enjoyed themselves and followed up with me - have become my regular assists and make decent money every time I have paying work for them. A few days of their time, patience and timing has led to thousands of dollars for them. And I never ask them to work for free again. Being a photographer is not that different. Show your interest in something and have patience and your efforts might just be rewarded.
July 15th, 2010 at 1:15 am
Jason,
I think you have made a wise choice in your approach and it's encouraging to hear of up and coming photographers thinking carefully about how to best establish themselves.
I also appreciated your email reaching out to me and have responded in kind. A respectful attitude and a little humility go a long way and I hope that a few of your fellow "staring out" photographers can learn something from you.
@John Stebbins, just call it "shooting personal work" and avail the wrath of those who hate the term free.
July 15th, 2010 at 5:06 am
A photographer owes absolutely nothing to the industry or to other photographers.
As a professional photographer I don't really understand all the hate for other photographers that do things differently. It is a free marketplace.
My perspective is that it is kind of nice for photographers that work in that way to take "bargain hunters" off my hands. I can focus on clients and potential clients who see the value my work and pay accordingly for that.
If some yahoo photographer who doesn't make any money shooting is taking my market then I only have myself to blame.
Glad that isn't the case.
July 15th, 2010 at 7:26 am
"If some yahoo photographer"
It's the Google ones you need to watch out for
July 15th, 2010 at 8:16 am
I'm sure that getting assisting work, or second-shooting with wedding pros is a much better way to get the experience, portfolio and reputation than working for free.
None of the wedding pros in my town want to have a 2nd shooter from the same town helping them, because they're fiercely protective of their own business (understandably) and don't want to spend their time "training up" their future competition. There's only one actual studio, and they are pretty much the same (although they were kind enough to wish me luck). To get 2nd shooting experience, I'm having to look at wedding pros who are around 100 miles away from where I live - the amount that I'd be getting paid for the work will barely cover my travelling expenses, which effectively makes it the same as working for free..
July 15th, 2010 at 9:56 am
It's funny how many responses to these photo biz posts are from semi-pros who still just don't get it. However, some of the responses make an interesting point: Often, being cheap is worse than being free.
I can understand how doing SOME jobs for free can be beneficial – as long as you receive something valuable in return. Referrals can be valuable, as long as your reference testifies to the quality of your work and not your free or cut-rate services. Perhaps you might swap work for advertising.
Work done for charities and some non-profit businesses may be eligible for tax write-offs, too. Just make sure you send an invoice stating the full value of the job so that amount can be considered as a charitable contribution. You can do the same for non-charities, too, and write off the amount of the invoice as a promotional expense.
And ALWAYS retain your copyright for future sales. That should be a clear, overt understanding with ANY pro-bono client.
Do some research and find out what the true value of your work is. It's a deep hole to dig out of when you build a reputation on low prices or free work. Consider the quality of your clients, rather than the quantity.
July 15th, 2010 at 10:40 am
You sound very much whiney when you write like that.
"And you’ll be making lots of new friends among the professional portrait photographers whose livelihoods you are damaging. Happy networking!"
Butthurt anyone?
You've got a point with this article, and I do agree with you on many things, but try to be a bit more mature+objective next time, okay? Thanks.
July 15th, 2010 at 10:59 am
Good luck getting paid for concert photography. So many bands now a days have fans with nice glass that just want a photo pass and a chance to shoot their favorite band.
July 15th, 2010 at 12:04 pm
The problem with this article has less to do with the author's position, but the tone.
To me, he comes across like an entitled child whining about others taking away his business instead of explaining why he can't get more business on his own.
The pattern I've noticed in many industries is that customers gravitate towards two polar opposites: the best or the cheapest. What this means is that everyone in between is in a major struggle to get business.
What I've also noticed is that you generally get what you pay for. Those with any skill or artistry aren't going to offer their services free or cheap forever.
So why is the author seem so threatened by people who aren't charging for their work?
Going back to my original example of the best vs. the cheapest, I highly doubt that any top photographer worries about losing business to junior photographers charging peanuts for shoots. So what does that say about this blog author?
As a tech consultant, I get undercut all the time, whether by outsourced consultants or less skilled consultants. I don't fret over it. I let my prospects know why I'm worth my rate. If they are extremely cost sensitive, usually they're not the type of customer I want anyways. As far as I'm concerned, you have to adapt to the marketplace. If you don't have a reason for prospects to pay you the premium (i.e., reputation, quality, etc) then you have to change your business model. Don't expect the world to change FOR you instead.
July 15th, 2010 at 1:19 pm
Well, I'm conflicted. I am in the process of making a career change from long time corporate IT management to photographer and I've heard the message "don't give away your work" loud and clear from my instructors at Western Academy of Photography and from the pros I've associated with loud and clear. And it makes sense.
I would not have asked, in my old like, a prospective IT hire to come work for free on a project...if the work gives value then shouldn't there be value received for it?
Having said that, I don't have a proven track record in many facets of the profession so maybe...maybe...if I want work in those areas I need to consider rationalizing some free work as marketing and promotional expense. Maybe. Some excellent discussion here, but some useless vitriol as well.
July 15th, 2010 at 3:52 pm
Guys - I have to say - with all the snark I'm reading here (especially from the author, jeez), it's not easy to see why falling fees have become a problem in the industry.
My father is a photographer and I have much respect for them but let's not lose sight: you're a service provider. You can possess all the talent in the world but if you can't have consummate respect for your clients, then you're bound to fail.
And another thing - if you're experienced and you know a "noob," take the initiative to reach out and spend a couple hours mentoring them. It's called Karma and it's good for you!
July 15th, 2010 at 5:20 pm
So what you're saying is that even if you just picked up a camera, you should hang out your shingle and start charging for your work as a professional.
July 15th, 2010 at 6:05 pm
This is by far one of the best lists I've read in a while. I'm including this in my weekly roundup tomorrow, that's for sure.
Great compilation, just great!
July 15th, 2010 at 6:35 pm
Let's face it; all industries have problems getting the price they need to make a decent profit. Photography / photographers are no different. While on one hand many of us bemoan the state of the market in our industry for fees, many of us also bitch and moan about the high prices of gear (Nikon D3x anyone?) and rip off software to process images (there are about 1,000 torrents on Pirate Bay alone for Photoshop!).
July 15th, 2010 at 8:49 pm
If you are competing with people who are giving their work away, then either (a) the quality of your work is "less than professional," or (b) you're simply fighting a fight that you'll never win (same quality - lower price wins). Based on what you've written, I think it's probably time for you to step your game up.
I compete EVERY DAY for my job. Sometimes I get it, and sometimes another company takes it from me. It's called competition. It's based on knowledge, service, politics (shock), and - you guessed it - price.
If I don't win, I don't eat, and I can't pay my mortgage. That means I bust it EVERY DAY to make sure I'm going to keep what business I have and try to grow just a bit more. It does NOT mean that I go to my competition and cry that they're not charging enough.
From a photography aspect, technically, since I don't pay the mortgage with it, I'm apparently not a professional. That doesn't mean that my work sucks, and it doesn't mean that there's not a market for my work.
Remember that photography is the EASIEST creative field into which one can break. The biggest step for anyone is gear. Hand someone with 6 months of photography experience a 1D Mark IV or a 3Ds, and their images will be considerably better than they were with their P&S. Hand someone with 6 months of violin experience a Strad, and they'll still suck. I'm not saying that it's ALL gear, but gear is a BIG part of the game.
That means that if I fund myself (being an amateur, right?), and my gear is better than some "pro," then my images stand a pretty good chance of being better. Is that bad? No. Why should I be put down for my experience (hobby - right?) and my investment in my own gear?
If I choose to give images away (and I do every year), that's my prerogative. Does that take money away from some starving pro? I'm not sure I care, but I can imagine that the answer is sometimes yes (because the "customer" would have paid for the shots that I provided) and sometimes no (since they might not have been in the market for photography anyway -- it's called a "gift"). If you want to sell your images to the people that are currently my "customers," then man up and show them your stuff is that much better than mine.
Your post sounds like "I don't want to compete or run a business. I just like making pretty pictures." That's called a hobby, man. Realize that you have a JOB (hopefully a career), and that a JOB means that you have to WORK.
By the way - I agree that you either charge full price or you're free; cheap is never the way to go.
July 15th, 2010 at 8:54 pm
Walked past a restaurant yesterday. $30 entrees, $50 mains, didn't even look at the desserts. McDonald's give you a whole meal for $10! That restaurant will obviously be going out of business very soon thanks to the undercutting.
Or is it possible the people who eat in that restaurant would never eat McDonald's, and the people who eat McDonald's will never pay $100+ for a meal?
There are niche markets, and quite frankly if you're not talented enough to justify your high prices and continue to get work when compared with the amateur selling his images burnt to CD for $100 then you should probably try a new gig.
I hear McDonald's are hiring.
July 15th, 2010 at 11:30 pm
In general I've seen that a large majority of photographers are pretty poor business professionals. I really wonder how many people on here are running mortgage paying businesses (as in it brings in enough income to pay your mortgage) when they are saying that free or even cheap is a good way to get started. Fields like photography generally have a lower general income potential with those few shining stars who have a combination of knowing the right people, talent, hard work and business savvy to really make a business. When I see annual gross income numbers for what most would consider "large" photography studios - and compare it to any other industry small businesses, one has to realize that photography is almost a micro business. My parents small family dairy farm's gross income is almost quadruple of a few of the "big names" in the photo industry - that really put it in perspective for me. My husband and I owned a studio - excellent customer service and good business practices set our business apart and allowed us to charge a price for our services that we were comfortable with. I've met tons of photographers who bought a nice camera, called themselves professionals and gave away FREE sessions and photos at below cost in hopes of getting paying clients - I have never seen one yet that has moved on to a full time (mortgage and food covering) business. It might be a nice hobby to justify nice equipment but nothing more. I'm sure there is someone out there that it has worked for . . . but I would guess that they are few and far between. Best wishes in all your endeavors.
July 15th, 2010 at 11:49 pm
"Don't take photos free of charge, even if you're doing it for fun. You're putting Joe the corporate picnic photographer out of work"
"Don't come crying to me when some Indian takes your day job"
What an incredibly consistent, well-thought-out, non-racist rant you've got here.
July 16th, 2010 at 12:46 am
What's with all the vitriolic crap? If you don't agree with John that's fine...but what is with the people slinging insults around? Have those of you saying "You're just whining because you're obviously not good enough to compete" got John's client list in 'your' back pocket?
Those of you who do should be "professional" enough not to be shoveling dirt, and those of you who don't aren't in a place in the profession that warrants you slinging crap.
The guy's obviously a) making a living at the craft, b) not saying anything not being said by many others, and c) making valid points. It doesn't mean I agree down the line...my personal jury is still out on the question. What it does mean is that I'll conduct myself with civility...maybe you should too.
July 16th, 2010 at 11:14 am
Fees are certainly an emotional issue, eh?
These conversations actually ARE constructive, but I concur with the pleas for civility. I think you have to open yourself up to other perspectives and proceed from there.
I think John's original post does have an angry tone to it. But before you bash him, consider why. The market for photography is changing rapidly, and not for the better if you actually want to make a living doing it. Many, many established pros are finding themselves increasingly undercut, and often it has nothing to do with the level of talent. Some of you are saying that if John is talented, then he should have nothing to fear - it's just sour grapes. That's not necessarily true, however.
I noticed the gourmet restaurant/McDonalds analogy. I think part of the problem is that, more and more, art buyers are shopping for price instead of quality. They are willing, more than ever, to accept McDonalds-quality work, then try to dress it up with Photoshop. So, a major part of the problem is that the customer base is driving prices down to the point that photography is becoming an an unsustainable, un profitable profession.
And buyers will continue to do that as long a photographers work for those kinds of rates.
There are all kinds of business models, and there are two that seem to be at odds here. Do you want your photography business to be volume driven, like McDonald's, Wal-Mart, or Microsoft? Or do you want your biz to be quality driven, like The Four Seasons, Macy's, or Apple (iPhone 4 excepted)?
Danger, and anger, is produced when too many are charging quantity prices for quality work. It's unsustainable because eventually the whole profession becomes unprofitable.
A free market demands competition. But there is healthy competition and unhealthy competition. Healthy competition creates a sustainable and diverse market. But the win-the-job-at-all-costs-attitude is not healthy. It can hurt yourself and others because you will eventually find you can't make a decent living doing this and there is no more incentive for customers to pay living wages to anyone else.
Many of these posts are contradictory, too. Some are saying that photographers have no obligation to others when setting their fees and rates. Yet others are crying out for guidance from the same photographers they have no obligations to.
If you are new to this profession, do some homework. Do some research. There are LOTS of resources, and Black Star Rising is among the best of them. Just recently, there were a series of posts about pricing weddings. (http://rising.blackstar.com/how-much-should-you-charge-to-shoot-a-wedding.html) They cite an actual wedding web site (http://www.theknot.com/) that determined the average fee for wedding photography is around $2,400 – from a survey of 21,000 brides. That's an incredible sampling, so it's a great place to start. And not hard to find.
If your established competition is reluctant to share their fees with you, perhaps have a friend pose as a potential client to glean some info. While that competition might not look kindly on that if they find out, it's better than ridiculously undercutting their prices. Plus, it helps establish the REAL value of your work in your market, too.
I also think that too many "noobs" simply don't consider everything necessary to create a viable business. They jump in emotionally. But take the time to consider ALL of your costs - insurance (for your business AND FOR YOU), office and administrative costs, advertising and promotion, etc. After that, don't forget to pay yourself a salary. How much money do you want to make. How many jobs per year do you see yourself shooting? All of that should help you decide what kind of fees to charge. Here's a "Cost of doing business" calculator: http://nppa.org/professional_development/business_practices/cdb/cdbcalc.cfm
Not to dash your dreams of being a professional photographer, but if you come up with fees that your targeted customers are unwilling to pay, perhaps you should consider a different profession.
I think what John is trying to say, behind the angry tone, is "Hey, be BETTER than I am – that's fair competition. But don't undercut my prices to the point that the profession is no longer profitable for ANY of us."
July 16th, 2010 at 11:21 am
to get experience:
I recommend donating your time to a charity that you would give cash to if you had the cash to donate - and then - asking to be listed as a sponsor for the event, in the same amount $$ that you are donating - or - trade out for an ad or listing in whatever they might publish.
This gives you experience - and you get something in return - not totally free.
Also - network like crazy when you are shooting for the charity.
July 16th, 2010 at 12:20 pm
Free sets the stage for further business which will be tough when you start charging your real prices. Talk to other photographers and find out what an average price is either per picture, per hours, per day..Go into the relationship with your eyes wide open.
July 17th, 2010 at 3:39 am
Wow, so this is really funny! I'm coming late to the party, but so glad I found it.
Regarding excuse #4, I'm the photographer he's refering to. His "excuse" is lifted almost verbatim from a comment I made on a blog post regarding this same issue a fair while back. Reading this all I can say is "Thank You" for the professional commentary on a situation you knew nothing about and felt free to use as an example based on incorrect assumptions and with a somewhat vindictive attitude towards someone you've never met.
July 18th, 2010 at 1:03 am
@Eric
LOL. You'd better quit blogging, you effing noob! You're taking away customers who would pay to hear someone's opinion, like this article. You're destroying the magazine industry with your free commentary!
God.. What a sad state the industry is in when "professionals" start publicly making excuses and pointing fingers because they can't make ends meet. The days of cheap, high quality gear are here. Get over it. Just like the days when HTML was a mysterious and magical thing and I could charge $40/hr to write code I could have written in my sleep. Well, people woke up and realized that they too can accomplish this and I found other ways to improve my talents and make real money. If you think some teenager with a Digital Rebel is destroying your customer base, then you'd probably be better off spending your time finding ways to improve, and quit crying about it. There comes a time in the life of any professional when you've got to push the limits and step it up, or step out.
As far as "free" work... My house, my car, my education, most of my gear, the jobs which paid for them -all- started with a "free" gig to get my foot in the door. Just don't be a fool and take the next free job that comes along. If they were interested enough to call you, they're interested enough to pay. If not, they're wasting your time anyway, wait for the call which pays, and start showing off what you've accomplished on that first free gig.
For anyone who is mad at their school for not teaching them business... Well, was it a business degree program, or not? If you plan to become a professional in a largely freelance industry, logic would dictate that you should study art -and- business. You may not have a use for a business degree, but don't let that stop you from taking some classes.
July 18th, 2010 at 4:03 pm
What David said. Grow up. If you can't take the heat, change professions. I shoot free because I'm learning technique, lighting, posing, etc. If I charged at this point, people would have expectations, and I'm not that good yet. I have to know I'm going to get good shots at a wedding or portrait shoot before I would even consider passing myself off as anything more than an amateur photographer, regardless of the fact that I spent over $5,000 on my camera and lens system.
David, You're my hero!
July 18th, 2010 at 4:14 pm
Its not free, as in, something for nothing.
Its a trade, such as, access for photos.
I dare you to make a "cattle call" to all successful shooters who have made trades that "worked" as they had hoped.
Otherwise, this blog lacks balance, IMO.
July 18th, 2010 at 7:10 pm
I disagree, I strongly feel if you are not ready you should not be charging a penny ! Hey if you want to have a rocking portfolio I say shoot away but do it at no cost if your not in business and likewise don't start a business until you are charging!But lets be honest even then I do Free shoots for Inspiration Through Art formally known as the Littlest Heroes project not only free but my next months trip for them will actually cost me over $120.00 but I think it's important to remember a part of being a business owner is to give back and reach out:)
July 18th, 2010 at 7:21 pm
and to Sam Obeid you rock my socks
love your work!I am your new site stalker in a non creepy way of course!
July 18th, 2010 at 9:31 pm
I will comment primarily on your stance in #7 and #12 from the viewpoint of a passionate amateur who loves photography but has no plan to "go pro".
Do you ever home-cook meals? Stop it right now! You are ruining the professional cooking biz for all the restaurant owners and chefs out there.
It sounds like you wish to launch an attack on anyone with an SLR who isn't a practicing professional. If I completely bought your arguments I should discard all my fancy gear, get a point&shoot and stick to snapshots of my immediate family only (if at all).
I agree that you may have some points in your criticisms of pros doing free work, but there are situations for pros where it's useful or necessary to get bootstrapped, and you are going *way* overboard when you include all non-pro work in your arguments.
July 19th, 2010 at 4:16 pm
I agree 100% with this post and am laughing at some of the comments and unprofessional attitudes people have towards this article.
Running your own photo biz is not easy, but you do need to know what the industry standard is and what is a bad deal for all of us. Notice I say "US"
not pro or amateur or someone who just picked up a camera at your local box store and calling themselves a photographer. We are all in the same boat.
I think what makes a professional photographer is someone who can make a living with their camera AND make educated business decisions to continue growth. If by doing a free shoot leads you to landing a family portrait for 200 bux than congrats. So whats next after that? Is that 200 going to pay your mortgage, car payment, groceries, insurance? How many times a year do you think that same person needs to update their fam photo, each month, every week? Probably not, so where would you be next? Sitting in front of your computer searching Craigslist for your next shoot?
I certainly am not trying to take over this comment board but I had to post this incase you missed it a few months back. I feel it goes along with this same theme.
http://rising.blackstar.com/photographers-dont-fall-for-these-client-pick-up-lines.html
July 20th, 2010 at 1:21 am
You're just cranky because some people stole some opportunities from you.
I'm a highschool student with no interest in taking up professional photography. I do some fun stuff for free over the summer when I'm bored.
July 20th, 2010 at 9:46 am
@ Bruce W - you sort of missed the point, yes I home cook meals (for my personal use and the occasional dinner party), but I don't run a full-time free restaurant.
Sure take all the photos you want for your own use (like cooking at home for your own use) even give them away to friends and family if you like.
But don't put yourself out their as a pro and do free work for clients who should be paying. If they are going to make money from your photos, they should pay. If they like your work and ask you to shoot for them, they should pay.
Yes everyone needs to get experience, so practice (for free) with your friends and family - for a little while. (giving them an invoice that has been discounted, lets them know what your photo service should be worth).
Or donate your time and photo service to a favorite charity that you would give cash to if you could. And in this case, I provide the charity with an invoice for the full amount of the shoot, and then discount it 100%. I ask for sponsorship of the event or a listing as a donor in the category that I am donating my photo services.
When someone comes asking me to shoot photos for them, I'm charging a reasonable fee. I need to stay in business as a pro (or even PT amatuer). So charging for my experience (and to cover overhead, education, equipment, etc.) is appropriate. After a customer has been a good client for a while or when they do big jobs - I can give them a discount, but not before. (consider the loyalty cards you get, not for the first purchase but for the 10th purchase).
Whenever you 'give it away' with the hopes of getting the paying job in the future - the paying job rarely comes thru. The customer just finds the next 'sucker' willing to give it away.
Other industries have figured this out, photographers should too.
It is flattering to have someone like your work and want you to do something for them, but even more flattering is when you get compensated for it, when they realise the value (and talent) of what you do.
July 20th, 2010 at 1:41 pm
I wrote a piece on this that some may find interesting:
http://www.bluefilter.co.uk/2009/06/prostituting-yourself/
July 20th, 2010 at 2:04 pm
I guess to each their own...
For all the Haters, you may disagree now, but when you have to make a fulltime living off your craft you will look back at this and laugh. For the over passionate IT guys...don't you hate it when the kid down the street who is a really good hacker starts marketing to your clients for free? And to pour salt in the wound...to all the newbies shooting everything for free...my response is
"I fix free wedding photography"
And I will make 3 times what I would have had the bride booked me origionally. So its all good...go shoot it up
July 20th, 2010 at 2:21 pm
Free photography is a great form of advertising if you know how to do it effectively, and who your target market is. We do free photography as a way to get our foot in the door with potential clients and it works like gang busters. We tell our potential clients that no one will work harder for your business, and then prove it by shooting for free. It has more than doubled our business and we are now moving into more and more markets. Free photography is nothing more than one tool in a bag full of marketing tools. Google gives away almost everything for FREE, it does not seem to harm their business at all.
Do not fear free photography, just use free photography wisely.
July 20th, 2010 at 2:46 pm
I am sorry this is a horrible article. The article is saying that you NEVER do anything for free and "why" the first ones are a "bogus" excuse. And I disagree with that just about 100%. I have listened to many many top photographers and pro's making a HUGE living off of their photography that have almost all said that everyone does the few free shoots at first and they also recommend it.
If it where not for a few free shoots that I have done I would NOT be where I am today making a FULL living off my photography. I am not saying to do them often at all or even more than just a few times but come on... NEVER? And I also have done a few charity shoots that only a creep would charge or even accept money for.
For example I am just getting into the video side of things and I want to see what I can do for wedding video business so I have offered one or two free shoots with other photographers that are going to be doing a wedding anyways and I am going to tag along and shoot some video to get some portfolio stuff and to test it out. There is NO WAY it would be responsible for me to charge someone to do video at their wedding day for me to "try it out." And I know that anyone that has shot weddings ect before would be furious if they found someone was charging even a small amount to be the videographer/photographer for a wedding their FIRST TIME... Including the author of that article.
July 20th, 2010 at 3:45 pm
To the blogger & his supporters:
Thanks for "free" advice.
To the photo consultants who make a living
giving advice to photographers:
What is your reaction to all this?
July 20th, 2010 at 4:52 pm
To add to my earlier comment, a distinction needs to be made between working for free and working for nothing. The first indicates that you are not being remunerated for your efforts, but you absolutely should be gaining in some other way that makes the effort worth while. For instance, you may be working ona long term project on a given subject and offering to do some "free" work for someone or an organisation could get you access that would otherwise be hard to gain.
Working for nothing suggests that you do not value yourself or what you do.
In short working for "free" can be a smart move. Working for nothing is for mugs.
July 20th, 2010 at 9:06 pm
Wow, bitter much? Very poorly written article consisting almost exclusively of the authors whining. My favorite is when he assumes that a college student pursuing photography can have no other means of making money other than "mommy and daddy." A few of his points actually could have been perfectly valid, but once buried under his drivel lost all weight with me. Sorry, but whining and complaining like this is something I'd expect from a 5 year old.
July 21st, 2010 at 7:52 pm
Hi I am a qualified photographer and also a member of professional bodies.
I have been looking to get mine and my husband's business establised for the last year or so, changing between the area and direction we wanted to go in. In england there are companies that you can pay (quite a lot) to organise models, locations and help you build a portfolio. I have not used this option and have inevitably offered sessions for free in order to build our portfolio.
It is a good way to get images and people have more trust in your ability if you have a full portfolio to show off, I would if I were going to book a service I would naturally want examples, wouldn't you? I would just say do not let everyone spread you as FREE, set a limit of how many free sessions you are prepared to give away and then draw the line.
Hope this helps any one out there who is starting out, we are still building our profile now
Thanks Jenny
July 21st, 2010 at 7:55 pm
Wow! What a read!
Can't help but notice that the guys on John's side are all seasoned photographers who happen to see both success and failure around them just by being there and working in that environment.
Oh, and the other side clearly expresses itself as the team of losers. Here you have more types. You have the not-even-beginner type which IMHO will probably never become something in this field of work just because they know it all. Also you have the beginner with a lot of nerve - doing it once is not enough. Heck, doing it for a whole year and you can still screw it really bad.
It's nice to be young and stupid. It's even cuter when you actually try to literally move the mountains.
My issue is with the experienced guys. Shame on you! You have families, you have worthy charity causes, you are still learning new things (in comparison with the other team which knows it all besides pricing and that first time doing something). Why are you wasting your time? You have sites, you have blogs - the same as the others. People who can understand something of what you can teach CAN contact you. Doing polemics online with these idiots does not help anyone, not even your ego.
And if you don't believe me check the list of replies and ponder. So you have your experience and you know these things are right and those who thought otherwise are long forgotten. The idiots also believe beforehand they know how things really are. You (the older and hopefuly wiser) haven't converted any of the other team. You just gave a few the fuel to insult you.
Simply put: Mr. A does a gig for a good sum (whatever that sum might be). If the client is unreasonable, Mr. A can walk away. And this is the measure of achievement - to not be impressed by the money alone. Mr. Jr is a poor student believing in the power of the freebie. Mr. Jr won't receive anything, or, at best, will have some of the costs covered. What's even more interesting - if the client is not satisfied Mr. A will be hired with new terms and with a bonus to fix what Mr. Jr did. Here comes the sweet part. Mr. Jr is that supid he thinks there's no difference between them two, only some missing business contacts. And he can do that just because he has no idea of what is going on around him.
July 21st, 2010 at 9:53 pm
I do photos of my friends and their kids for free to be posted on facebook. And for me to get the experience. Since I started doing that I've had several offers from people who want to pay me to take pictures of them and/or their kids. And I'm not a pro and have never been to school. So tell me again why that's wrong? Could this article maybe be the result of someone whose business is doing so hot and they would rather blame the people who are doing what they can to get a foot in the door instead of looking at themselves?....
July 22nd, 2010 at 1:32 am
this is dumb.
July 22nd, 2010 at 3:26 am
@J Mills (and others). There is a long history of great photographers approaching people they find interesting and offering to photograph them to build on their portfolios/projects/styles. But this is categorically not the same as shooting someone for free if they have approached you. In this case they have presented a demand for a service for which they should expect to pay and we (the photographers) should charge. Not charging skews the market and says to prospective clients that photographers do not value what they do, so why should we? The most extreme example of this to happen to me was a magazine editor approaching me about an image of mine she had seen that she wanted to use as the cover and asking me to pay her! Her logic - other photographers will pay to get a cover image. I declined because I value what I do, and I have a successful practice that supports my family without my having another job. I have no problem with competition, but it does need to be based on realism. Charge a fair price for what you are asked to do, and then we can compete. But give it away and you undermine the very profession you claim to want to be a part of.
July 22nd, 2010 at 8:20 am
Having done several free photo shoots, I ensure to achieve my purpose of doing it and try as much to avoid been seen as a 'not-to-be-paid' photographer as people could take immense advantage of opportunities if 'terms and conditions' do not apply. Doing free photo shoots gives more room for flexibility and creativity which when applied on paid photo shoots produces awesome results.
Free photography is a good form of advertising if you know how to do it effectively and know where your potential market is,its actually a bag full of marketing tools and its worked for me a great deal.
'Free photography works when used wisely'
July 22nd, 2010 at 8:42 am
You have maybe 1 or 2 valid points, but the rest makes you come off like a whiney child having a tantrum. If your photography is good enough, you will never compete with the likes of free photographers, and craigslist photographers. Because your client will want to know that you can nail what they need, instead of gambling on some mwac or hobby shooter. And if they want that, you're going after the wrong clients to begin with. Let people willing to do stuff for free have those clients.
July 22nd, 2010 at 10:24 am
horrible article. If you think that the only way for you making money is other photographers not doing free assignments - you're wrong! Get over yourself and don't try to find issues with others, take that kind of photos that people would love to pay for them, simple...
July 22nd, 2010 at 12:33 pm
This post (and many of the responses) seem to be drawing so much controversy because the muddled thinking behind them conflates two somewhat conflicting ideas:
1) "If you do free work, it's bad for your career."
2) "If you do free work, it's bad for MY career."
An appropriate response to #1 might be, "Thanks, although some people think it's worth the risk, and I need to consider their viewpoint as well."
An appropriate response to #2 would be, "Yeah? Well, tough. If you run short of cash, I'm not obligated to help you jack a liquor store, and if you can't cut it as a picture salesman, it's not my responsibility to bail you out."
The opposed nature of these two viewpoints accounts for all the head-butting that's going on. But it misses the real point, which is: The price of ANYTHING is exactly what the market says it is, period.
A lot of people find it hard to get their heads around this concept, but there's no avoiding it. You can try to prop up prices artificially by yelling at people who undercut you, in the hope of restricting supply. In the long run, though, it just plain doesn't work.
July 22nd, 2010 at 1:08 pm
@ Ranger9 The points you make are logical but they don't really address the whole picture.
To your point 1 my response would be as I have written earlier, that there is a world of difference between working for free and working for nothing. If you work for nothing, you have no career. Working for free is fine provided your are gaining something non-monetary that enhances your career prospects and that you would likely not be able to gain any other way, or as effectively.
To your point 2, I would add that you are right, it is not your responsibility to help me out, you are only responsible for your own career. BUT, if you wish to have a career you cannot behave in a manner that undermines the very industry you wish to be a part of. To make this clearer, there are a great many people who are now "posing" as photographers, offering, for example, weddings at a fraction of what they would HAVE to charge if they did it full time. How can they do this? Their primary source of income is something other than photography, so from their perspective shooting a wedding for a couple of hundred dollars is earning them pin money for no outlay. But if photography was their only source of income they would go bust very quickly charging that sort of money. Some will say, "yeah, but I am just starting out and I need the experience". True, but why wreck someone's wedding so that you can practice being a photographer. Much better to get an assistant position with an established pro, and let them guide you to the point where they are ready to send you out to shoot solo. Soon enough you will get the experience to enable you to set up alone. You earn, you learn, the market isn't distorted, and the client is getting a proper job. Another way to look at it is this: suppose WalMart decides to start making cars. Is it going to sell them at only $200, rather than $20,000 just so it can get some practice? Hey, you need a car? No problem, I'll give you one for free cos I need the practice at making them! Of course they won't. But for some reason photographers seem to labour under the misapprehension that the only legitimate business stance is one of being a starving artist. Rubbish!
As I have already written, I have no problem with competition. Most of my competition around me charges less that I do, but I know I offer a better service and product and my client base is content to pay the premium for that. But as far as I am concerned that competition is valid and correct: they have set prices that they believe reflect their position in the market, and the playing field is level. If I am to stay in business, my game needs to be genuinely worth more than theirs. This is exactly your final point about the market dictating price. But remember, market economics tells us that the marginal utility of something that is free is 1. That is, if I offer you free photography, you're going to take it! But working for free should NEVER be the starting point when a potential client approaches you. They come looking for a service (they demonstrate demand). If they say they have no budget look to see what else they are having to engage for this project that requires photography. Suppose it is a brochure. Are they paying a designer, a printer, the ad execs, the wages of the person that is asking you to work for nothing? The only reason they can come to you with the "we have no budget" line is that they KNOW that so many people are so desperate to be photographers that they will simply roll over and say "OK". That is just not business.
July 22nd, 2010 at 8:11 pm
For all those of you that think working for FREE to get experience is ok, or that it is ok to work for free for friends, answer these questions first!
1. You have been arrested on a DD and are likely to lose your licence and your job.. your best mate is a Solicitor/Lawyer/Barrister, no go and ask them to defend you in Court for Free for the 'experience'.
2. You are backing out of your garage and run into a concrete post causing £200/£300 worth of damage to your car in parts and paint, but hang on, your mate down the road has just opened a bodyshop, go and ask him to repair your car for free for the 'experience'.
3. You have an absys on your tooth, it's been killing you for ages but you can't afford a Dentist, but hang on a moment, George from college is a Dentist, go and ask him to remove the tooth for free...
Now whilst some will offer you 'mates rates' etc, I very much doubt they will work for FREE or for the EXPERIENCE, why, because they are in business and if you want to be taken SERIOUSLY as a Professional Photographer, remember it is a business....!!!
On the other hand, I just bought a set of tools for £1K, does it make me a mechanic now, will anyone let me work on their Porsche for the 'experience' I need or would you rather take it to a garage.
Come on people, get a grip and treat the Profession with a Professional Attitude and act Professional.
July 22nd, 2010 at 8:19 pm
You must gain more from every shoot than it takes you to do it. That gain can be non-monetary (perhaps you do, indeed, need to build your initial portfolio) but you should move away from 'paying to work' (where you a spending more doing the job than they are paying you) as soon as humanly possible. Preferably before the first job.
If you are making photographs for because it's a hobby and you enjoy it... fine. I won't begrudge you any more than the guy that helped me replace my brakes for free. However, if you are making photographs with the intention of making it profitable you need to ... make it profitable. (that means: charge more money than it takes you to do the job after calculating your TOTAL costs).
July 22nd, 2010 at 8:46 pm
OMG! Louis Torres please!! I am shocked after checking your website!! Not sharp, over expose images! Luck of correct composition and cropping. You lacking basic skills as a photographer I am not surprise you work for free!! I suggest land a job as an assistant for a good photographer! Gat paid from day one! . Dan open successful business when you ready!. Good luck
July 22nd, 2010 at 10:45 pm
When a new doc graduates medical school, does he offer freebies, discounts or otherwise. Get the point cheapshooters.
July 23rd, 2010 at 9:49 am
OK well running the risk of feeding the trolls here but .. When was the last time you got anything for free that was any damn good and not inferior to something that you had to pay good money for?
There is a reason good photography is not free and never will be. It's not about taking pictures (most everyone can to that) It's about being professional (how many "Free" photographers have back-up kit and P'L insurance. Running a business is at about 20% photography (if that) It's all the other stuff that you need to consider.. Just think about it before offering your services for free, tat's all
July 23rd, 2010 at 4:19 pm
CharlieH said:
When a new doc graduates medical school, does he offer freebies, discounts or otherwise. Get the point cheapshooters.
Not really a good comparison though is it Charlie? Doctor - Photographer?
I mean you don't get members of the public buying scalpels just to do a bit of domestic surgery at the weekends do you?
July 23rd, 2010 at 5:29 pm
I agree to a good extent of this in that the market is overcrowded with stupid people who will do anything for free, it ruins it for people looking to get paid.
Craigslist for example is a bastion of people looking for photo shoots for free and thats not right. If you offer it yourself, then that is acceptable, it's YOU defining what people will receive to suit YOUR explicit needs.
When people dictate to you what will be done and that you will not get paid and then you jump at it, then you are just a bitch doing bitch work, which usually is useless garbage and not applicable for a portfolio - expecially when its just a party or something.
July 24th, 2010 at 12:55 am
I have been doing the very same thing and now I'm getting all sorts of offers on the table... Now I'm doing workshops it's all great
July 24th, 2010 at 3:29 pm
WOW, I have used nearly every excuse and got EXACTLY the result you described. When I started charging a fair price for my work, nearly all those "time sucking" wanna-be freeloaders vanished and I have replaced them with pride, professionalism and paying customers.
July 24th, 2010 at 6:18 pm
I love this sir. You hit the nail on the head again and again and again.
Fot the folks who want to get good so they give it away, I always use the example of: if you book a wedding for $5000 - you would instantly get good because there is more at stake. Experience cost you no matter how you look at it.
July 25th, 2010 at 12:45 am
What a very bitter man. He obviously forgot what it is like to start out.
July 26th, 2010 at 5:23 pm
This sounds like someone who is quite bitter. It's not the 80's anymore folks! Budgets are smaller! It's sad - but right now, NOBODY knows what the photo budgets of the future will look like. Who knows if they will exist at all... All the bitching in the world is not going to stop the YOUNG, TALENTED, and PASSIONATE photographers of tomorrow working for $0. In terms of gear/money, all you need is a consumer level camera and cheap computer...
July 26th, 2010 at 8:00 pm
To all Photographers wannabe please STOP!! Working for FREE!! You only ruining your INDUSTRY!! Budget game is Simple for last 30 years Customer goes to 10 or more studios and compares prices!! If one of us work for FREE!! They will NOT! Pay for Our services NOW OR IN THE FUTURE!!! STUPID!! YOU only ruining the INDISTRY You hoping to work in the FUTURE!! ALL Professional Business people now the game, what is wrong with –PHOTOGRAPHERS-??????
July 27th, 2010 at 9:36 am
@ Jonathan. Your comment is astonishingly ill-conceived.
Yes budgets are smaller than they were. True, no one knows what the budgets of tomorrow will look like. BUT, there is always going to remain a demand for professional photography in whatever form that it exists. As long as there is media of any type, there will be a demand for professionally crafted images. The key word in that statement is "professionally". If a person or organisation approaches a photographer to ask them to produce images (be they social, editorial or commercial in nature), then they exhibit a demand. It is, always has been, and always will be the case that anyone expressing a demand for a commercial transaction should be prepared to pay for the service. Absolutely every other person involved in the provision of a website, brochure, magazine, advert, TV programme, print etc will have been paid for their input. For some reason it is ONLY photographers that seem to labour under the misapprehension that it is OK to work for nothing. Why? Primarily becasue they go to college to be taught how to take pretty pictures of trees and leaves and rusting car wrecks, but no one thinks it is necessary to teach them anything about running a business. As a result, when they enter the big bad world of commerce they feel as though they shouldn't really be there, and are embarrassed to talk about money.
I have lost count of the number of times I have heard "photographers" start a negotiation by saying "my rate is $xxx, but I am prepared to negotiate". For goodness sake, don't undermine yourself by saying that before the client has had a chance to respond to your "rate".
Jonathan, you state: "All the bitching in the world is not going to stop the YOUNG, TALENTED, and PASSIONATE photographers of tomorrow working for $0." My response to that is that if they are not being paid, they are not working. Remember, there is a qualitative difference between working form nothing and working for free. It is normal for photographers to approach others and offer to work for free for someone because it gives them access to something tangible and significant that helps their careers. But if someone apporaches you there have to be very very compelling reasons for agreeing to work without pay.
It's all very well saying that all you need is a consumer level camera and a cheap computer. I disagree with that statement, but even if I agree with it, these things still have to paid for. How exactly are the "YOUNG, TALENTED, and PASSIONATE photographers of tomorrow working for $0" going to pay for these things (and that is without mentioning PI, PL, EL, and equipment insurance, or all the other costs of business, and don't even think about paying rent, feeding yourself, having a life etc etc.)
The real reason that this problem exists in the industry is there is a perception of glamour. There are so many people who want to call themselves "photographers" and they just can't get a break by charging, so they prostitute themselves instead and do it for nothing. But that act undermines the industry they want to see themselves as a part of. It is more of an issue since the digital revolution becasue they can strafe the subject and hope they get a few acceptable hits. When I started out you actually had to understand exposure and compostition and film characteristics because you could not afford to waste materials. I used to have an annual lab bill of $40,000. You can only afford that if you are charging to do the work. Just because there is no film cost does not mean that there are no costs. My pro spec cameras get worn out in about two years. In practice, everytime I press the shutter release it costs about 3 cents. If you buy a consumer level camera it will actually cost more, not less. Then start looking at storage costs, backing up, software and computer upgrade costs. How are you going to pay for that if you work for nothing?
In the UK for the last few years there have been 10,000 people annually gaining some form of photographic qualificaton, chasing at best 500 jobs (and that is being generous). The competition is already really huge. Neither I, nor any other good photographer I know, has any problem with competition. But the reality is that whether you charge or not, if you are setting out, the likelihood is that you will NOT succeed. It is not enough to be a great photographer, you have to be a good business person too. In fact, the vast majority of successful professional photographers are not and never will be considered to be "great", but they are good business people. That, whether you or anyone else reading this post likes it or not, is an absolute irrefutable fact. Where there are execptions, those people employ agents or managers to look after their business affairs - and you show me an agent that sells their photographer to a client for free. In fact, it is well known that the reason for using an agent is that they will get a MUCH higher fee for their photographers than the photographers would get themselves. So much higher, that even with a 50% commission the photographer is usually better off.
So, where to do we stand with this whole working for free thing? I'll tell you where I stand: a customer approaches me and asks what I charge. I tell them. If they say that they cannot stretch their budget that far, I will discuss with them what they can pay and what, realistically I can offer them. If we cannot reach a compromise, I walk away. I know that they will go to someone who works for less, and I have no problem with that. What I hope is that they do not go to someone who works for free, but if they do, in the long run it is ALL photographers that suffer.
There will be some people who read this that will disagree in a very visceral way. If you are one of those, ask yourself why you feel like that. Then ask yourself if you would do a different job for free. The fact that you like being a "photographer" is not a justification for doing it for nothing. The only justification for doing it for free is as a passtime, in which case the client is you, not some third party.
For myself I am busy and well paid, and I KNOW that that is because I conduct myself professionally and produce good work. I employ professional services to assist me (lawyers for contracts etc), and as a result clients know that I am serious and in business.
Yes I negotiate, but in a business like manner.
For example, I have just taken on a commercial job that the client thought was three days, I made the case strongly that it was simply not possible in so short a space of time, and told them it was at least six days, more likely eight days. After negotiation they agreed to eight days, and I made some concessions on the rate, but they are paying more than three times what they originally thought it was going to cost. Why, because they see that the value I can add to their project will pay them back at least a thousand fold what I am charging them (and trust me I am earning well from it) - in short it makes commercial sense.
And that, in a nutshell, is what every photographer should be asking themselves before they commit to a job: does what I am about to engage in make "commercial sense"? If the answer is always yes, then with luck you will still be a photographer 20 years from now. If not please post back in a few years time and tell us all what you are doing instead... and whether you do it for free.
July 27th, 2010 at 1:43 pm
If you don’t like the term “working” than consider the term “volunteering”. Whatever you wanna call it, I speak truthfully when I say that I know of many many cases where a photographer has produced images for a commercial body or magazine for nothing other than a photo credit and bragging rights.
Here’s a pink elephant, my vision of the future (I’m sure this will be very unpopular): Out of all of the folks who call themselves “professional photographers” about 0.1% will be actually paying for all of their costs of business, their mortgage, their assistants, (everything) and turning a profit to boot. They will be shooting for big business clients, ones who want the very “best of the best”. Then there will be about 5% of the “professional photographers” out there who work another job to make ends meet (such as IT) and shoot jobs about once a month. They will be paid, but poorly. Why? Their competition will be so fierce from about the other 94.9% of “professional photographers” who shoot for free or next to free. Oh wait, I’m not talking about the future anymore but rather the present... Hmm..
M, maybe we are coming from different worlds. I shoot fashion. I assisted some quite well known fashion photographers in the early 2000’s. After looking at your site, I see you shoot different things than I do. I like your pictures and I can see your talent would be an asset to a commercial client. However, the fashion budgets are horrific right now. I am assuming that the rest of the markets are not doing so well either, judging from the comments above.
All you really do need is a consumer level camera and a cheap computer. These kidos generally already have a computer. The camera can be gotten. The part time job maybe could finance it? Bank of mom and dad? Or Visa? What about the cost of doing business? Well, you said it yourself; these people are not actually working. So, they’re not actually doing business. Equipment insurance? Why insure a $1000 camera? Paying rent? Feeding yourself? Uh, thin is in... Bottom line is though, these kids are talented and produce images at no cost to clients. So yeah, “clients” are happy and (most importantly) not using the other “professional photographers” (who cost more).
Hey, it sucks. This is what’s going on in my world though and all the photographers out there who read this take warning, it’s coming your way. Try and be in that 0.1 percentile and you’ll be OK. OK?
“It is more of an issue since the digital revolution becasue they can strafe the subject and hope they get a few acceptable hits. When I started out you actually had to understand exposure and compostition and film characteristics because you could not afford to waste materials. I used to have an annual lab bill of $40,000. You can only afford that if you are charging to do the work. Just because there is no film cost does not mean that there are no costs.” You sound just like the guys I assisted and I totally agree with you. However, it also sounds like you’re upset. Again, I don’t blame you. But please, don’t contest what I’m saying. I’m living it. You don’t have to understand film exposure anymore and composition is subjective. Even though pixels do cost money, a lot of people don’t know they do (like a lot of clients) and let’s be honest – they are cheaper, less than a $40,000 lab bill. Storage costs? Computer upgrades? Uh, my MacBook Pro (the 2004/5 model) along with my pirated copy of Photoshop can handle a file from a P45 no problem let alone my digital Rebel. Yeah, it’s a little slower than your MacPro but who cares?! I can’t afford a new computer and it works fine!
“You show me an agent that sells their photographer to a client for free” – I could, but we’re in public. OK, I couldn’t tell you how much the client paid the agent, but I could tell you that the photographer shot the job for free/bragging rights.
“What I hope is that they do not go to someone who works for free, but if they do, in the long run it is ALL photographers that suffer.” Already happening, see pretty much all the comments above as proof.
“The only justification for doing it for free is as a passtime, in which case the client is you, not some third party.” True. We’re going in circles. The clients, in the end, gets nice HighRes photos for free. Neat.
I think you have a good business sense (probably better than mine!) but you are a little in denial about what is happening and where we are going. I know I sound very defeatist. I just hate surprises. I mean, there’s a reason this blog post got written in the first place.
July 27th, 2010 at 6:37 pm
Jonathan, you suggest that I may be upset and in denial. I am far from upset, my business is lean and efficient and turns a decent profit. I own my own house and have a wife and three children, al paid for by photography. My business is growing, and every year I improve my margins by finding more efficient methods of practice. My software is legit, my equipment is top end. In the next three months I expect to upgrade my studio lights, my computer system, my data archives, and my cameras and some lenses. All of this is paid for through a profitable and reasonably well run business. There are still things I could do more efficiently and I address each issue that bothers me in turn. In short, I am far from upset. The digital revolution has been difficult, but I have come through it well placed. Next up is the stills/HD video revolution. Where will that take us I wonder?
As for denial, I have no illusions about what is going on in the industry, and like I said, there are occasions when shooting for free (not for nothing) can make commercial sense. For example, you say you are in the fashion world. Well, I know a photographer (very well known in the fashion world) who shot an entire campaign for a top drawer designer for free. Actually, the shoot cost him about $20,000. It involved A list models, sets, makeup artists, retouchers etc. Why did he do it? Because the designer was so high profile that he was GUARANTEED a ten page spread in every edition of Vogue in the world. It was a loss leader that generated an enormous amount of business for him. Naturally it was a contractual obligation that the designer did NOT tell anyone that he had shot for free. The thing is, he was already shooting for some of the biggest names in entertainment and fashion anyway, and that is how he got the chance to pitch for such a big account.
So what then is my problem? What is it that is making people write blogs like this one? It is the simple fact that I feel like I have come across a group of people who are complaining that their house is burning down, and yet their solution is to pour gasoline (petrol) on the flames!
I am fed up with hearing people moan that there is no money in photography anymore, and then blaming the market, the editors, the art buyers, the PR people... everyone they can think of except themselves. The simple fact is that the people who are screwing the photography industry and making it impossible to earn a living are the photographers, not the buyers. The buyers are responding rationally to a situation created by the glut of people who want to call themselves photographers so much that they will pay for the priviledge. Every time a photographer agrees to work for free, or starts a negotiation by saying that they can negotiate on price before the client has responded to the quoted rate, they hammer the nails into the industry's coffin a little further. It is that that pisses me off.
It is time for photographers around the world to wake up and smell the coffee. It is not that the business has gone sour, it is that they are not treating it as a business. Instead of going to another free Photoshop seminar they should be paying to go to a negotiations workshop. I know of one company that was approached by one of the biggest companies in the world to do some work for them. The company's response? "You can't afford us!" Red rag to a bull. It made the approaching party more convinced than ever that they could NOT afford NOT to use them.
Stand outside the world of photography for a moment and look at it dispassionately: none of the arguments make any sense. Yes budgets are getting tighter, that is the reality of the world we are living in at the moment. But in every other industry it mean restructuring to meet the changing climate. Some companies will fail, and others will actually grow through recession. But in no other industry will you see companies working for free - it is a luxury that they cannot afford. As a result, although most sectors have seen falling demand, the industries themselves remain properly balanced. Now consider photography, lets consider fashion specifically, since that is the area you mention. Budgets are constrained, but they still exist. Designers are still trying to run a business, the fashion magazines are still selling and drawing advertising from design houses and companies with lifestyle products and services. Fashion shows are happening, models are being paid, as are set builders, chandlers, make up artists, lighting companies, events coordinators, caterers, security companies, PR agecies... I could go on. All of these people are being paid. So how come when it comes to the photographs - the very things which the fashion industry absolutely needs in order to maintain consumer interest and as a result cash flow - there is suddenly "no budget". Of course there is budget. But if you were in their position and you KNEW that "young talented and passionate photographers" would work for nothing, what would you do? You would say you have no budget, book someone, and then laugh about their gullibilty with your colleagues over a bottle of Bollinger paid for out of the money you saved by not having to pay the photographer. I repeat: it is not THEIR fault, it is OURS.
The facts are these: not everyone that wants to be a photographer can be one. Just like not everyone can be a Hollywood A lister or drive a Bentley. If ALL photographers stopped this working for nothing (not free) bullshit at once, and started to behave professionally, the future of the industry would start to look very different very quickly. Do you seriously think that if we all charged or refused to work that we'd just have no pictures anywhere anymore? Of course not. The budget would suddenly appear because it was always there, lining the pockets of the clients that should be giving it to you.
You gave me a vision of the future. I'll give you mine. The number of "professional photographers" will shrink, but there will be plenty of paying work for all of us that treat it as a business, not just as an art. Even the art photographers I know that are successful treat marketing and business very seriously, that is why they are publishing books every year and getting funding. That is why I have signed a commercial contract in the last three months that is worth a quarter of a million dollars over the next three years. What will it take to make my vision come true? It will take everyone that is a photographer, or wants to be a photographer, starting from the basis of believing in themselves and believing that what they do is important and adds value. Know your worth and stick to it. If you think the state of the industry sucks, then do something about it, because our future really is in our hands.
July 28th, 2010 at 5:57 am
Hi dear thanks for the article. These r the same sentiments i shared with a doctor friend of mine who did the same mistake of shooting a friends wedding for free since he earns his own livelyhood from teaching and is passionate about photography but after hearing my side about the issue he realised his mistake and he has forwarded this article to me . Thanks again for the article cause if we can change the way people approach maybe we will all have more clients at our disposal. Yours truly a professional photographer form INDIA.
July 29th, 2010 at 5:42 am
I agree with you Michael, and the author and all professional photographers who support the author's view. While reading all comments what I can clearly see is that it is not the author who presents a bitter view about the photography profession; it is the haters who are really bitter and I'll tell you why: They do not like to see the reality. They do not like to be reminded that they are not there yet. It makes them think that they are not good enough which is a feeling they want to hide from continuously since their confidence is very low as a photographer. You'll find them eager to review your photography so that they can criticize it and prove to themselves that their own work isn't that lacking in quality. They're not defending "free" or "work for nothing", they're defending their lack of confidence in their photographic abilities and that's why sounding so bitter. And they will keep denying you (what do you expect?). It is a reality that most of the people who argue they support "free" or "work for nothing" because it will help build their portfolio, are those who have not even gone to any school and only been trying to learn photography and "look like a photographer" by trial and error. Since real paying clients don't and won't allow them to do trial and error with their money, they are big supporters of "free / work for nothing" ideology. Why I'm using both terms is many of these haters don't even know the difference between "free" and "work for nothing". Some of them really hate you for being a professional photographer but at the same time are quick to ask you "How" to do it.
The profession of photography has received much damage from the hands of these "trial and error, attempting, blaming-others'-work, I-will-do-it-for-free-because-I'm-smarter-than-all-professionals-who-are-fools-because-charge-money-for-something-I-can-do-for-free" types of people.
I tell you the reality: These are NOT professional photographers. period.
And I suggest the solution here (which the professionals should take seriously):
Define clear criteria to distinguish professional photographers from these "self proclaimed I-will-do-it-for-free" type people with cameras. Its like maintaining a policy that to be called a professional photographer you have to have X years of experience, including apprentice-ships/assistant-ship(s), certain knowledge of the photographic processes, basic business ethics and business awareness, and portfolio(s) as minimum requirement. It is the professional's responsibility to make such policies and have them implemented instead of just "advising" non-professionals to behave professionally (they will not listen).
If a doctor or a psychologist needs qualification plus licensing to practice why shouldn't a photographer do the same? The reason the non-professionals are damaging the whole profession is that there are no clear policies as to who can call themselves a photographer. That results in everyone with "any camera and a cheap computer" call themselves a photographer. Well believe me, to save the profession, you have to limit the opportunities of work to only the professionals. Haters are going to hate me even more for this, (should I care?) but that is how all other service-providing businesses work.
The analysis on part of the professionals for not having done that so far is that most are primarily concerned with doing what they are passionate about: professional photography. And like all artists, are busy creating art. But they should not let the nay-sayers take advantage of them or devalue their services. Form some international and national organizations, establish clear-cut policies, issue licenses or have the local administrations acknowledge professional photographers with licensing, raise your voice against "fakers" and discourage anyone who wants to take a short-cut onto calling themselves a professional.
To art loving photographic community, these might sound like very bizarre and biased suggestions, but they are actually real world practices of almost all organized businesses all over the world. No one becomes a doctor just by "practicing for free", they go to school and do placements and internships and never work for free.
Dear professional photographers of the world, if you want to be in a respectable and organized profession, you have to struggle to make it one. Don't just leave it at mercy of those always willing to steal others' dignity. Otherwise, professional photography will definitely see its downfall sooner than later.
August 1st, 2010 at 6:12 am
What other professionals don't charge when they're just starting out? And when was the last time you asked or expected anyone to perform a service for free? Even a trainee gets paid minimum wage.
August 1st, 2010 at 2:33 pm
Free sample = basic marketing technique.
Via mail, via coupon, via sidewalk handouts, etc.
(Starbucks, McDonalds, art museums, events)
All in the name of future sales.
August 2nd, 2010 at 9:56 am
When your a multi million dollar corporation like Starbucks, McDonalds and others you can afford to hand out "free samples" but they are costing pennies and coming out of a marketing budget tied to a marketing plan for making money. Your not Starbucks or McDonalds. Try calling up your power company, water company, phone company, insurance company, bank, mortgage lender, camera store and ask anyone of them to give you services for free and see what they say. Enough said. If you say no, it means your in business. If you say yes, then your a student or hobbyist and not looking to be a professional.
August 2nd, 2010 at 11:29 am
Ok, this has really struck a nerve with a lot of people. There are many views out there and one should really take it or leave it. I have been a "professional" photographer most of my life.(I'm 45) I still don't understand why so many shooters are so stuck up. I got over myself years ago. It's a business, it's a hobby, its a creative outlet and anyone can do it if they love it and keep at it. For years all the how to books and "pro's) said offer to shoot for free (they pay for processing) to get some experience. That advice has been around for ever. There comes a time when YOU CHARGE. In see no issue here, just don't take for ever to do so. If your great and you shoot for free more power to you,just remember while your shooting for free everyone else will be enjoying the wedding you too were invited to. I stop shooting family and friends weddings period. I want to enjoy myself too. Bottom line do everything and anything to get your work and name out there, just don't go broke trying. Have a goal, a plan and keep at it. We shoot shoot for ads all the time, don't forget to advertise yourself. Competition will always be there so stop complaining and start competing. Digital has change the world in which I live and grew up on , but it has really help out in ways I didn't think possible. It's easier and cheaper. Just a point I shoot film as well and charge a whole lot more for it because....well they'll will pay for it. So keep yourself flexible.
August 2nd, 2010 at 2:47 pm
It continues..
I cannot speak for the meaning of 'Professional' in the U.S. but in the U.K. to call yourself a 'Professional Photographer', most Trade Organisations will require you to provide evidence that it is your trade, that at least 80% of your income is from your photography, that you hold Professional Liability Insurance etc etc...
I have a bit of a 'niche' market and can often sell a 'Limited Edition' Print in excess of £1K each, but I could not do that if I did not take my PROFESSION seriously and understood business acumen...
Over the years I have tried to help 'up and coming' photographers only to later see them attempt to quote my clients HALF of the price I charge. Luckily for me the Bulk of my clients know with me they will get what they want or more and are willing to carry on paying the price for it because they know their business benefits overall.
... and on a final note, for those of you asking why I will not tell you what I charge, it's because I see you as a competitor and will not give you the chance to undercut me... if you want to learn 'prices', there are enough Organisations that publish 'the going rate', do your friggin homework and stop expecting everyone to carry your arse around all your life...!
August 2nd, 2010 at 2:52 pm
"Author: Greg E. Mathieson Sr.
Starbucks, McDonalds...can afford to hand out "free samples" but they are costing pennies... Try calling up your...water company..phone company..camera store and ask anyone of them to give you services for free..."
1. pennies per person = hundreds of thousands $$$ per promotion -- they get it back plus much more
2. water companies offer free "green" showerheads in exchange for old showerhead; phone companies offer free phone, free months in exchange for 1 yr or 2 yr plan; camera companies offer free loaners for testing...
Photographers with common sense marketing skills may offer a "freebie" when there is reasonable expectation it will really be in exchange future $$$. If one is newbie, one should learn all about how to do it best -- just like any other skill.
Many pro photographers have no problem with using free interns -- where's the outrage from anti-freebie pros against this "in exchange for" strategy?
Many pro photographers have no problem with buying free lunch for potential clients -- IRS promotes it -- so where's the outrage from all the angry anti-freebies? Are they protesting by NOT taking business deductions...?
August 2nd, 2010 at 3:12 pm
One may get a new shower head from the water company or a free phone from the phone company or even a camera loner, but odds are the shower head is cheap, the phone is the one they have tons of an trying to get rid of in that it's not the best and loners are for those that can't afford to have the equipment needed for their business, though there is rare times for that one special need and not worth the investment. But yet we believe in camera companies supporting those that support them. Yes, we buy a lunch or two and in many cases, the clients do the same. But we have yet to ever meet a client that wants something for free and then takes you to lunch. If they do, then the lunch is your payment and not worth taking. And with interns, I see students needing time for college credit, but you get what you pay for. Someone that needs to learn and may take time away from your business. There's a cost associated with everything in business and it's laid out in a proper business plan and budget.
August 4th, 2010 at 1:54 am
Hmm shooting for free for that "exposure", "experiance", etc.
I have shot new concepts/directions for people at a reduced rate, but not free. I always state the real rate for a shoot, then show the discount/trade involved.
I actually get more trade in kind on both services and product from those who want lower rates than what I am willing to do. Example, CS5 master Suite for Adobe emloyee price for a family sitting. Free labor on car repair, house install of solar panels, etc... Usage and Prints still at regular cost and stated up front, so no suprises to either side.
One client using this method had wanted a look that ultimetly failed, we tried 5 different looks/setups. In the end the final one won and was .highly successful. Counting all the trades, etc, income was more than equal to what straight pay would have been
Trying new lighting ideas? grab the rolodex with cool friends, clients, invite to a photo shoot party. All prints bought at regular price. Discount (small) on those sold on location, this feeds the impulse buy.
You want to learn how to shoot something, then assist with someone who knows how. get some real practical experiance, not book.
August 10th, 2010 at 10:21 pm
I started doing photography when I was 15 and ALWAYS charged. Sure, I was far from great, but that's why I charged less than I charge now.
At first it felt like I should be shooting for free just to get some more experience, but I didn't want to fall into the trap of second-guessing myself constantly and the worth of my work. Overall, I'm beyond happy that I started charging even for my first shoots. You just gotta fake it til you make it!
August 10th, 2010 at 11:56 pm
Hmmmm, I don't really buy into this. In very crowded markets you must build a strong portfolio. And it's just a fact that if you don't do some pro bono work you'll have a hard time.
You also fail to mention charities and non-profits: I've done a lot of shooting for no fee for many local rescues and shelters and aside from the satisfaction I get, I get referrals that pay. Giving is good business, and developing a reputation as someone who is not driven solely by money can only help your business.
August 11th, 2010 at 1:30 am
I would think that if a person slapped the title of photographer under their name and set a fee for that service without 1 photo to their credit as an example of their ability they probably arent getting very many jobs offers. Perhaps the trick is to build your portfolio by whatever means and then simply know when to say no to free shoot requests. Photographers who do not get paid for their services are most likely too mediocre to do so anyways and the only people that should be upset by this are other photographers who also aren't good enough to make any money from that line of work. A good photographer will make money no matter what. If people want average photos from amateurs for free then so be it. If they want quality work, they know they will have to pay for it.
Also, I am not a photographer, I am a wardrobe stylist and it has been my experience that although photographers may frequently scoff at free shoots they are also often the first to ask for free services, such as wardrobe. Photographers frequently request "test shoots" which is basically saying that they do not value your profession or find you vital. It is an insult. If the photography community is so concerned about being "undercut" by some of their own offering free services, it might be nice to give that same respect to all the others involved in creating their art.
August 11th, 2010 at 3:08 pm
First off, I will state outright that I am an aspiring photographer and not YET a true professional. I don't earn a living from photography. Truth be told, I'm the "IT guy" described in John Harrington's blog post, except that I'm not so naive. I actually think John Harrington is an incredibly knowledgeable person in regards to the photographic industry and should be respected as such. I've purchased and studied his book, Best Business Practices for Photographers, Second Edition; it has made me aware of so many things I would never have even considered about the business side of photography. I think that, the technical and artistic aspects of photography aside, anyone who would call themselves a professional photographer ought to do everything in their power to have a firm understanding of the business side or hire someone who does. I feel that this is essential and cannot be neglected if one wishes to have a sustainable presence in the industry. This is what your favorite pro would say.
So, with that said, I UNDERSTAND and RESPECT what many of the "pro-pay" photographers are saying--especially those photographers who are earning a good living from their work. Nothing succeeds like success. I agree that, as a general principle, a photographer, be they amateur or professional, should not work for free if approached by a potential client. I'm sure that there are valid exceptions to this rule, but, as others have stated, most any other professional who provides a valuable service would not render it for free (unless it were for charity, perhaps), the moral being--"if your services are good enough to be solicited, then they are also good enough to warrant compensation." No argument there. I get it 100%. It's the law of prosperity--he (or she) who would become rich must in turn enrich others. Just think about it--the only reason anyone earns money from *any* occupation is because of the value it provides. I'm not saying that the "pro-free" or "pro-cheap" photographers are wrong, but I do know that free and cheap are not sustainable business practices unless you're operating on a mass scale (e.g., Wal-Mart). It's safe to presume that none of the "pro-free" and "pro-cheap" photographers hope to reach that scale.
My stance on the matter is this--and, again, bear in mind that I'm the IT guy Mr. Harrington describes. I agree that there are the bottom-feeders who will charge little to nothing for their work. I do not feel that people for whom charging little to nothing is a long-term strategy are cause for concern for a respectable professional in any field; if your work is really of professional quality, then you are NOT in contention with the bottom-feeders by virtue of the quality of your own work and the fact that, again, free and cheap will not sustain a business on the micro level. If there were a way to take what Annie Liebovitz does and make it free and cheap, well, then the industry would be doomed. But that likely won't happen. So, good work still commands a premium. As others have stated, the clients who seek out bottom-feeders are not the same clients who will solicit your services because they already know that they can't afford you. Even if this sort of client were to seek you out, you'd likely turn them away because you know the value of your own work and also know that these would-be clients cannot afford its cost. Summa summarum: a good professional photographer probably doesn't attract clients who can't afford them in the first place.
So, if you're producing professional quality work, I presume that you are probably not in contention with bottom-feeders.
Well, I'm not a professional photographer but also feel that I'm not in contention with the bottom-feeders, either. Nor would I count myself among them.
I don't work for free in the sense that I am approached by would-be clients and agree to render my services for nothing. It's quite the opposite. I approach models, many of whom have professional experience working with major brands, and experienced makeup artists and request that we collaborate. There's no exchange of cash and, to be sure, I am the one who initiates and coordinates the entire shoot, the purpose being to build my portfolio. I may even come out of pocket for things like wardrobe or set design, but that's because it's *my* vision that is being persued. I have vision, know my goals, and will NOT sit idly waiting for someone to hire me to produce the type of work I'd like to see in my portfolio. This is radically different from being approached by a client and being asked to shoot for free. The modeling agency doesn't call me up and say, "Hey, Michael We need you to shoot some portfolio images for the new talent we've recently acquired. Could you do it for free?" No, *I* peruse the agency's talent, handpick the models with whom *I'd* like to work and who would benefit *my* portfolio, and then contact the agency, saying, "Is this person available for a shoot?"
Q: Who selects the model?
A: I do.
Q: Who chooses the shoot's theme?
A: I do.
Q: Who picks which and how many images are produced from the shoot and in what format they are delivered?
A: I do.
Q: Does cash change hands?
A: No, but then, no one's making any money and the shoot is mutually beneficial to all parties involved--the model; the makeup artist; and myself, the photographer.
Q: If the agency contacts me to shoot their new talent, would I charge?
A: I sure would.
Why do I do it? Precisely because I'd prefer not to be in contention with the bottom-feeders. Nor, for that matter, am I aiming to be a middle-grade photographer. I want to shoot a specific type of photography, working for a specific type of client. I want my work to be regarded as boutique and know that, just as shooting for free won't help me reach my goal, neither will shooting anything other than what I choose and self-assign get me there.
Pro photographers--Keep pushing! Enhance your craft! You're actually not in contention with the bottom-feeders, because your work distinguishes itself as professional grade and is likely inimitable by the likes of rank amateurs. But know that you're not in contention with guys like me. Truth be told, just as you probably wouldn't want the type of client attractive to bottom-feeders, I probably wouldn't want the type of client attracted to many of you, precisely because my goal is clear. And, make to mistake about it, I do intend to be compensated--and WELL.
August 11th, 2010 at 3:58 pm
@Peter from artphotoonline.com
Wow. Insulting Louis Torres like that? Your stuff is just as average.
August 11th, 2010 at 7:08 pm
The key point you are missing is there is a “friend economy” that exists. Friends fix your fence, watch your dog, and pick you up at the airport. In the process they take away business from fence builders, pet sitters, and taxi drivers. If I want to take free photos for friends I do it because I want to, not because I have to.
If my “product/service” is equal to a pro then the pro better find a new line of work. (In addition, I don’t have to pay business taxes, lie about income, get a business license, or stress about an audit)
August 11th, 2010 at 10:59 pm
Michael,
For those "starting out", it should be shown to clients that you will have a TEMPORARY discount. Figure out your pricing structure, (I recommend reading "The Lucrative Photographer" to help with that) Then offer a limited percentage off of your pricing. This is how I and many others I know of have done it. I even started to low to begin with and once ready to charge more (and that happens very quickly!) you have to keep raising your prices and then marketing to a whole other market of clients. It's a lot of work and very frustrating. You also realize how quickly your time is worth when you don't have much of it left and people waste it.
August 12th, 2010 at 7:50 am
While I agree for the most part, a majority of these type of rants, be it for photography or writing for publications, is centered around established photographers/writers trying to protect their interests, because they know anyone willing to take photos or write for free will be "hired"/used before a charging professional. So don't be totally fooled by articles telling newbies they shouldn't sell themselves short, because sometimes being able to undercut an established photog/writer works as an advantage. If you're starting off, offer a discount or say you're willing to work the first job for free on the agreement you will be paid an established rate for a guaranteed second job and builds rapport with an employer.
August 12th, 2010 at 9:36 am
You kind of just sound like a super douche. Congrats.
August 12th, 2010 at 12:29 pm
Then there was the studio owner A who gave a bride a $300.00 discount.
When studio owner A sold to owner B, the sister of the previous bride came in to talk about her wedding. Since owner B would not GIVE AWAY his work for $300 off, sister storms out in a huff.
Proof that a referal from free work is worth more FREE work.
August 13th, 2010 at 5:30 am
educate me.
August 13th, 2010 at 12:04 pm
I think is not polite to say that you have to grow balls..... if you really want to make a living of photography nothing will be for free....
Even those guys that do it for free, they dont realize that all his or her equipment has cost thousands of dollars and where that money come from huh!!! there's always a cost....
happy hunting......
August 13th, 2010 at 3:35 pm
I'm afraid the cry of "what do I do I'm new" just doest hold water as an argument. If the argument goes...
"I haven't done it before so I cant charge" Then follow it to its logical conclusion in other jobs and professions.
3 Examples
1 -Bus Driver
would give him (or her) Bus and passengers, pay no wages and say "get on with it Ill pay you when you can do the job"
2- Lawyer
let them try Death penalty cases and only pay when he/she considers themselves competent enough to ask for a fee
3- Soldier
Hand out out a weapon, ammunition, some grenades, a bayonet and uniform saying we will work out what we owe you if you make it home
Up coming Photographers. Do what every other person does.... get some training then act like a professional and charge for you're work.
Quote
"Intellectual Property is the oil of the 21st century" Mark Getty, chairman of Getty Images.
Remember every picture you take is you're Intellectual property why give it away, you wouldn't give away an oilfield if you owned one would you?
August 13th, 2010 at 6:13 pm
I want to be a New York hotdog vendor. I see them in films all the time and think they look really cool - they always get to chat to pretty girls on the street and personally I think they must have a rich wonderful life full of interesting characters and fleeting flirtations.
I don't feel confident enough just yet though to actually live the dream, so first off I'm going to hang out on the street near the other hot dog guys. Maybe they'll give me some tips. Then I'll use my IT job wages to buy a cart. I can't pitch it in the street without the permit but my boss has said that if I cook all the food for the rest of the staff at company events then he'll supply the food and let me make hotdogs!!! I don't charge him of course...I'm not convinced that I know how to make THE perfect hotdog just yet. Oh, the guy that used to be paid to do the events has just had to close up his pitch on the street because the events used to enable him to pay for his stock in bulk. Once I get enough experience I'm going to start working his old pitch. And I'm sure my boss will start paying me to do the events by then, simply because I'll make the absolute BEST hotdogs. It's not like he would just try to get another amateur dogger like I am now, I mean how could he - I'm unique!
VS
I want to be a hotdog vendor because I think it's cool etc. I'll ask the guys how they got there, if they need a part time guy, I'll check it out online and get proper advice. Then I'll weigh it up and decide if I should leave my decent paying but unfulfilling job. Maybe it will be worth it to pursue my dream. In that case I will make sure I learn the business sense to make it happen. Otherwise I might be better off buying a hotdog cart with my savings and have great parties for my family and friends without the pressure to succeed in business.
That's how these things happen; rightly or wrongly.
August 14th, 2010 at 10:11 am
To: "Michael Epperson said:
July 13th, 2010 at 12:43 am
So, what do you suggest a photographer to do when they're just starting out and have very little experience? Charge no matter what (even though you're not a "Pro" yet)?. It's kind of a catch 22 situation."
This is simply NOT true...or should NOT be....photography is a VISUAL ART! You can see it, it doesn't matter if you're new or 40 years in the business, pictures don't lie. If you want experience then work as assistant, NOT advertise or do gigs as a "photographer".....dentists are in the same boat, a crown is a crown is a crown either coming from someone new right off college or someone that's been in the business for 40 years! the end result is something that you CAN SEE/USE.
We as photographers create CONTENT, that CONTENT is used in advertising, marketing, to promote SOMETHING....OR to CREATE ever lasting MEMORIES for people......There is no short cut in our business, once you click that shutter poof...same picture can be taken by 10 photographers, the ones who will stand out will be seen right away...Nothing you can hide. Either you're good or you're not.
"Being new" has nothing to do with price schedules...NOTHING. People can SEE your work. Plus, who goes around and tells customers they are new and are looking for "experience"??? if I were your customer I would NOT want to take a chance with my "memories" at all.......you don't get experience on people's events, THEY NEED those photos to be perfect......you get experience on your own, on your family, your own kids, then you go out and take photos of others....when you're comfortable that you won't screw up...that's why I said, if you want experience you work as an assistant and see "what" the pro does! if you can't get an formal education.
When I started this as a business I re-searched MY market and what it can handle, as I didn't want to be the most expensive or the cheapest in my area. You do this when you want to open an accounting office, law office, advertising company etc etc etc ....you can't charge Washington DC fees in Lutz, Florida.....your clients are NOT the same in these cities....when you price you have to be competitive, but that doesn't mean CHEAPER than others...competitive by what YOU offer different than others, maybe a different package, a different concept, something that will set YOU apart from the rest, so when ppl call YOUR studio they know they'll get something they won't anywhere else...........
PHOTOGRAPHY doesn't have to have the "pay the dues" theory at all......IT IS VISUAL....ALL VISUAL.......if people LIKE what they see they pay, period, like with Italian shoes.
If you work in the Mall at Picture People then sure, pay your dues, start at the counter and work your way up to photographer..............IF YOU ARE INDEPENDENT then YOU MUST have a great product to offer and not some elevated point and shot stuff and undercut the pro's!!!!!! That's it.
August 14th, 2010 at 10:40 am
"Greed, for lack of a better word, is good. Greed is right. Greed works. Greed clarifies, cuts through, and captures, the essence of the evolutionary spirit. Greed, in all of its forms; greed for life, for money, for love, knowledge, has marked the upward surge of mankind..." — Gordon Gekko lives!!! Next time Special Olympics calls, I'm going to tell them to shove it!
August 14th, 2010 at 1:11 pm
How much did you get paid to write this ridiculous article?
August 14th, 2010 at 1:41 pm
The "wit" in the original post was a bit vitriolic. However, with respect to most of the content, I'm certainly not qualified to debate with somebody of John's stature, experience, and other qualifications.
However, I will rebut the point about corporate events. An IT pro (why just IT? What about Accounting? or Marketing?) taking pictures of a corporate event may or may not be looking to go pro. In any event, participating in such events provides internal opportunities for the photographer seeking to further his/her corporate career.
I'm an active member of my company's photo club. Our photo club gets calls all the time to photograph various diversity/inclusion events, town halls, etc., for the company. These are opportunities--not for furthering a photographic career. But rather, these are opportunities for exposure within the company, and a great chance for networking. We aren't just nameless faces behind a camera--we're fellow employees, and actually do get noticed. And the participation does have a real impact come review time, as community participation is almost always part of a company's review process.
Another thing: An employee shooting at a corporate event had BETTER NOT be posting those photos in a public forum!! You will be leaving yourself wide open to legal actions and job loss. Simply stupid--why would somebody do that?? Employees at corporate events understand they may be photographed and that those photographs may be used in corporate literature/corporate Web sites. Employees at corporate events For the individual photographer publishing those photos on a personal/business Web site or otherwise, you're bordering on charges of corporate espionage, and certainly privacy violation. DON'T DO IT! unless you can get written releases from the subject, and a written permission from your company's legal department.
Personally, I consider all photos I take at corporate events to be property of and copyright by my employer--work for hire, if you will. I'm sure any corporation's legal department would feel the same. I appreciate the networking, I appreciate that my name is being bandied about in high places, I appreciate that I can bring something I truly love to my workplace, please enjoy the product of my labor.
Oh, and I shoot for free on Photo Walks, and when *I* ask a particular person if s/he would mind letting me take some portraits of them, or if I show up at an event with a camera...
That is all...
August 14th, 2010 at 11:33 pm
Unfortunately, the all-to-common sentiment "What are we supposed to do when starting out without a portfolio" and the presumption that work must be given away to get started or because we are not professional yet (your first paid job you will be a professional by the way - has nothing to do with abilities), is a seriously flawed attitude and business model that has created a monster in the photography industry - - - where there is now a glut of people with expensive and high spec'd cameras shooting assignments that would normally be providing paid professionals with their living. And any who have aspirations of making a few bucks after the first 2 or 3 free ones will find they will be so worried about not getting the next job as a result of the easy access people have to photographers who will be free or very cheap and give everything away for that, that they keep on in the same path. It is a no win situation.
For anyone who cares (which may be very few) - it is a path to destroying the incomes of many who have invested years, commitment, and much money to their craft and overhead of running a business or studio. Even seasoned pros are now giving into the pressure by reasoning that it is better to accept a lower price and get the job - than to not have the job.
Just a couple of observations from comments above:
In the good old days, most photographers got into the photography business by charging for their first assignments and every one after that. For the most part, we had to put a lot of effort into finding out what the local studio was charging and then may have stayed slightly lower than that to get the job - - - but it may have been a worthwhile compromise for the person hiring us based on their budget and their willingness to accept less experience. With each job, the fee charged was "upped" based on our increased experience and need for extra equipment.
For the most part - no one had samples to start with (unless you took a photography course at college). Samples were quite often test shots we had taken of family and the first paid jobs were essential to building the portfolio with "real working jobs". Yes that is - there is far more value in samples where people have taken a gamble and paid hard earned money for - - - than portfolios built from free jobs or working as a second photographer.
Thirdly was the comment about no pros helping noobees out - - - as if photographers who are now old time pros had access to the knowledge and experience of other pros. That seldom was the case and old time photographers were known for being tight lipped about their trade secrets and threatened by inquisitive photographers. Where as today, there are no more trade secrets - - - everything is an open book and accessible and either free on the web or can be purchased from the thousands of self professed experts in the field. That was not the case when I was building my business in the 70's, 80's and even the 90's.
For those noobees who are serious about getting into the photography business and wanting a little direction - - - please don't dismiss the valuable insight in this article. It is relevant if you have any intentions of not only making a living from photography, but surviving in the business for years to come.
Rob
August 15th, 2010 at 9:26 pm
I don't work for free. I might have once or twice in college (sometimes you have to to build your portfolio). I own Mr. Harrington's book and I will be the first to say he has done a number of things to help advance good business practices in photography, and most of the advice given here is worth heeding. But, as with anything you read, you have to consider the source and the context.
Here's the thing. It seems as if Mr. Harrington and a number of other "established" photographers are used to a comfy life with good rates and are pissed off to give that up. Being a photographer now has a much lower barrier to entry and I think is becoming akin to becoming a writer in the sense of what the job is actually worth. Baby boomers need to just learn to deal with the fact that the ways of living in the past aren't sustainable (for most professions not just photography), and no smart photographer expects to do much more than feed themselves with their pictures. Because photography is so accessible, and there is actually a glut of "good enough" work that many people are looking for, have you all considered the fact that maybe the VALUE OF PHOTOGRAPHY HAS GONE DOWN? Listen, I don't want to hear that as much as any other photographer, but it's true. It's just economics. Supply and demand. There's much more supply right now and yes maybe more demand but I don't think it's keeping pace. I personally am happy to make pictures that people seem to see value in, and if the gig is crappy I walk away from it. I also don't make very much money and work other jobs to make ends meet but it's better than taking crappy photography jobs and putting more worthless imagery out into the world. I wasn't working in the 80's like some people were when it was much more of a process to bring a quality capture to life, but really guys, it's just not that hard anymore. Stop trying to convince yourself that it's worth as much as it's always been. Be happy to pay your bills and have a room to sleep in like the young folks you all seem so scared of and then maybe it won't all seem so doom and gloom.
August 16th, 2010 at 10:49 am
very well written and very well explained, it will surely help some people understand how this industry work and the way clients perceive us photographers
thank you very much
Naor Gamliel
Israel
August 16th, 2010 at 5:15 pm
Free photos started photographer's path to fame:
"...he made deals with jazz clubs for access to rehearsals. In exchange, Leonard provided the clubs with marquee photographs..."
http://pdnedu.blogs.com/pdn_pulse/2010/08/herman-leonard-jazz-photographer-dies-at-87.html
Check. Checkmate.
August 16th, 2010 at 7:37 pm
@ Jeff Greenberg.
I went to school with one of Herman's daughters in the 1980s and met him on a number of occasions. He was a magnificent portrait photographer, and jazz was his thing. His passing is a great sadness.
But your comment, quoting part of the PDN obit for him and then finishing with the frankly rather infantile "Check. Checkmate", puzzles me. Unless I am misreading you, you seem to be using this as some form of definitive argument for those who think that working for nothing is the way forward. But you could not be further from the truth.
Read the quote from PDN again and then dig a little deeper for the truth: Leonard approached the clubs, not the other way around. Jazz was his passion, and he started photographing jazz musicians when he was studying at university. He was pursuing his own project. In the long run as people became aware of his passion and skill, the project pursued him and he started to make a living. But this is NOT working for nothing. He had his own project and he was working for access.
As his reputation grew he made a living from commissions from the jazz magazines and record labels. It was, initially, only a modest living, but when the work came looking for him, he charged. This is not, in anyway, "check or checkmate."
August 17th, 2010 at 12:01 pm
An excellent post!
Lots of people ask about how to break into photography and that they have to do friends and family shoots for free.
Well no they don't, they should work with a pro who gets paid and see what really happens.
The simple fact of the matter is:
Your camera wasn't free,
Developing isn't (or your computer)
Insurance isn't free (many new togs get sued)
Your rent(home) isn't free.
Your food isn't free.
The travel/car/fuel wasn't free.
Servicing and upgrading your kit is not free.
The clothes on your back are not free.
Photographer can work on their own projects and if people see value (want) the photo's then they should pay for them. I know many photographers find it hard to put a value on their work, but this is because they have little to no business acumen and is a sure sign of failure.
My list of things that are not free should be costed for every photo shoot and every print.
I wrote this article about photography as a business:
http://training.nationalphotographer.co.uk/2010/photography-as-a-business/
I dont think that many people do listen or understand how to opperate a business and how to stay in business.
August 17th, 2010 at 12:44 pm
I've been shooting for free and I'm fed up. I learned the hard way that it doesn't promote my business or my photography. Everyone expects free photography now, they don't even bother to hint at it and they get offended when I mention the session/image fees. I don't mind doing it for fun, my fun, because I happen to be at the beach with friends and I pull out my camera to get some great shots, but that's all from now on.
A connection sent this blog post to me, because, once again, I was trolling Craiglist for models to practice on. Never Again!!!
August 17th, 2010 at 1:34 pm
The "excuse" that "just because" all sorts of cameras are cheap and readily available does not stand a drop of water...because look at all the other industries, what? do you think there are no other apple computers? no accounting software?
(USING CAPS TO EMPHASIZE, NO FORMATTING IS AVAILABLE)
WE CREATE CONTENT! Like software manufacturers, our content is used so other companies make MONEY! the excuses and BULLY TECHNIQUES THAT MAGAZINES AND NEWSPAPERS USE THESE DAYS, "OHH WE HAVE NO MONEY, OHH SOMEONE ELSE WILL...OHH WHAT ARE YOU GONNA DO? SUE ME?" ARE OFFENSIVE TO OUR PROFESSION... WHEN THEY CHARGE THOUSANDS FOR ADS, (HAD A CLIENT PAY $10,000 FOR A 1/4 AD IN A MAGAZINE HERE AND WANTED TO PAY ME $200 FOR THE PHOTO SHOOT........I TOLD HIM THAT THAT'S NOT POSSIBLE, MY GAS IS NOT FREE, MY FOOD IS NOT FREE, MY DENTIST IS NOT FREE EITHER ETC........THEY GOT USED TO DO THIS BECAUSE THEY KNOW PEOPLE PREFER "PHOTO CREDIT" OVER FOOD, PAYING BILLS, ETC...THEY COUNT ON PEOPLE TO HAVE A DAY JOB...THAT IS COMPLETE BS as far as I am concerned.
If that's the case, then simply enough, kill all the photography schools and lets just lean on camera manufacturers to make cameras that do everything! maybe implant them in our heads too!
Photography is still an art, just because people choose to treat is as a commodity thanks to "human pride", and no other valid reason, that still doesn't make it a commodity. It would ONLY BE a commodity if, the gas to go to the photoshoot is free, photoshop is free, lightroom is free, computers are free etc etc etc....which is highly NOT the case! I wonder if Bill Gates would start going to work for free now that almost everyone has a computer, therefore a commodity! why should HE get paid?
You go and do your day job for free and then tell me how you liked it! there's plenty of competition in accounting too and graphic design, web design, music...writing...etc...neither of these disciplines are undercutting each other, why? because it takes time to create something of a value!
If you as a photographer don't value your own work, and feel the need to work for free, and are treating it as a "stupid, easy thing to do, anyone can" that means:
1. You're NOT a photographer
2. You have no self respect
3. You have no respect for this profession
so why would you even be allowed to carry a camera?
This has nothing to do with the 80, 70' and before...this is about WORK, If you get out of your house to shoot an event for a friend, you are WORKING, if you get out of the house to shoot your cousins wedding, you are WORKING! IF you have to get our of your pajamas and drive somewhere to photograph something for someone else other than YOURSELF, YOU ARE WORKING! WORKING FOR FREE IS CALLED SLAVERY! HAVEN'T WE ABOLISHED THAT AT SOME POINT ALREADY? WHY ARE WE BRINGING THAT BACK?!!???
I am sure Canon or Nikon gave you the camera for free too? right? or have you used REAL MONEY TO PAY FOR IT?
I fail to understand how you guys don't GET that!
August 17th, 2010 at 4:53 pm
actually, student get out of school (real photography schools that is like The Art Institutes, Brooks etc) come out WITH a portfolio created out of all the projects they had to do while in school etc...so, there's no reason for them to do anything for free.
A graphic design graduate also has a portfolio AT graduation time, also no reason to do anything for free!
August 18th, 2010 at 2:30 pm
I think part of the disagreement here comes from different photography specialties. In general, I would certainly discourage shooting commercial, corporate or editorial photography for free.
However, I have benefited greatly from both shooting for trade and shooting for "free" for causes I believe in. There are 2 caveats. 1 is that I only donate my time for causes I would support with my money. 2 is that I send an invoice when I shoot for free or at a discounted rate, delineating the actual value of the shoot, and the reason for the discount. So an invoice for shooting a non-profit event for free would include the same charges as shooting a corporate event, then have the entire total deducted as the "Kayte's pet charity discount" the "friend of Kayte" discount, or the "Jane Doe negotiated discount." That way, the organization knows what I really charge if anyone asks them, and the next event organizer for that non-profit will understand that if they are not Jane Doe, they may not get that same discount.
I get paid to shoot a lot of non-profit events. Many of the paying jobs have resulted from shooting initially for free for the same organization or a different organization.
The other thing about shooting for free (as opposed to trade), is that you should only do it if you can be happy giving that time with no expectation of return. Do it because you find the photography fun and challenging or because you support the person or cause you're shooting. That way, if it leads to more business, marketable shots, new friends...that's all bonus. And if it doesn't, no loss, no resentment for "failed" investment of time.
August 18th, 2010 at 3:10 pm
Some togs will,
some togs won't
some togs need a lot of wonga,
while some togs don't
There is no answer to this conundrum because every situation and individual is different.
Some togs will,
some togs won't
some togs need a lot of wonga,
while some togs don't
August 19th, 2010 at 6:27 pm
The only reason us pros hate the free shooter is that we can see that our business will be threatened, either now or in the future when the noob gets his act together. That's also why pros don't want to help the noobs. Why help you competition?
August 20th, 2010 at 5:58 am
Russ, can I make it clear that you do not speak for this pro. I actively help new people coming into the profession, and I have no problem with the competition they represent - it will keep me on my toes, and that in the long run keeps me in business.
There is, though, another reason why helping others is extremely beneficial: photography is often a lonely and solitary business, and from time to time it is good to be able to ask a competitor in the name of professional support to help you out. Why would they do that if all you do is beat them back? Trust me, for respectable working pros there is enough work, and it is good to be able to rely on each other for support.
Near to where I am there is one pro who is very underhand when it comes to undermining his competition. He once came unstuck and needed help, and everyone told him to get lost. The others I have helped and they have helped me and we all get along in a spirit of mutual respect and friendly competition.
In summary, I do not "hate" people who shoot for free, it's just that they undermine the industry they profess to want to be a part of, and in the end, they will suffer as much as the established pros because of it. In fact, my preaching that they should be charging is in their interests as much as mine, so by telling them to behave in a business-like manner I am trying to help them now!
August 20th, 2010 at 3:19 pm
Michael,
In the market I am in, I can assure you that it takes a lot more than being a 'respectable pro' to stay in business.
There is a major photography school here that churns out new photographers, by the hundreds every year. In fact, the number of new photographers that graduate each year is up by about 5x during this recession.
Unfortunately, they don't give the new photographers a plane ticket to leave town, so most of them turn right around and put up a Craig's List posting advertizing $200 weddings with a free disk with all the hi-res images. Some of them even advertize they will shoot for free to build their portfolio.
There are probably five times the number of photographers here that the market can support. Being the best photographer in town can only offset a portion of this problem.
The biggest problem is that the public has figured out that some of these new photographers are really good, and they come to me and demand that I lower my prices.
This has seriously impacted the amount that we can charge for weddings, and in this recession it has forced about 40% of the established pros out of business. I am charging less than half what I was in 2005 for an average wedding.
If this were taking place in your market, how would you feel?
Russ
August 20th, 2010 at 5:58 pm
Russ, you are right, it does take more than being a respectable pro - it takes having business sense.
London is not exactly the boondocks, and the market is massively oversaturated with would be photographers. Over the last few years there have been 10,000 per year graduating in the UK with some form of photography qualification, chasing in the region of 300-500 fulltime jobs. The problem is as real here as it is where you are.
Where your logic fails is "The biggest problem is that the public has figured out that some of these new photographers are really good, and they come to me and demand that I lower my prices." What you and everyone else in your area should be doing is busting a gut to make sure that the good ones get some business acumen and raise their prices, you should not be lowering yours - they will still get work, and make a lot more money in the process. The others, the ones who by definition are crap, will soon fall by the wayside.
I cannot understand why you are dropping your prices. There are many who have contributed to this post (and a similar one on LinkedIn) who have either steadfastly maintained their rates or actually increased them (myself included), and we are getting busier.
In the end, if you are doing this professionally, like any other business you have to calculate your costs of working, then add in your wages and a profit margin, and from that work out your rates.
If one does that, but doesn't earn a living it is possible that there is no demand for the services provided. Just because a person takes photos and charges, does not mean they have an automatic right to succeed - it can be that they are no good - so the business fails, just like in any other industry you care to mention.
What the "noobs" need to be taught before they are let loose, is how to run a business. Those that are good should charge properly and earn a living without being a threat to the good exisiting photographers. But those who are bad will fail, and the existing ones who are not very good will also fail when new better ones come along. That is simply business.
August 20th, 2010 at 6:52 pm
You can't understand why I'm dropping my prices???
In 2008 my bookings began a serious rapid decline and were half of what they should be by the end of 2008. If I hadn't done something, I'd be out of business and unemployed right now. By reducing my prices I managed to stabilize my business and save it.
I rewrote my business plan to address the lower/middle end of the market where I thought I could compete strongest against the noobs, and I was right. It's the high end business that has completely disappeared around here, the very business I used to depend on.
My competitors who refused to lower their prices or change their business practices are the ones who went out of business.
What the noobs 'should' be taught and what they 'are' taught are two different things. Unfortunately I have zero influence over that.
Russ
August 20th, 2010 at 8:05 pm
Russ, I have only one issue with your "format"...Adobe did not discount Photoshop, it is still $999/Upgrade $349
http://www.adobe.com/products/photoshop/photoshopextended/
I don't see them lowering their prices...same applies here, we provide content, our content is used in advertising, print and web, graphic and web design to create brochures etc, ALL this in order to create more revenue for the client! I don't see architects offering homes for free! or $300 down from $300,000!
Value is value, if you produce value, you have to stay with the value, if you produced value and now lowered you fees, you also lowered the value of what you provide. It is that simple, if "YOU" don't value your own work enough and are not aware that you are in business to make money just like Jo Accountant, then indeed our profession will be eaten by amateurs with a day job!
Colleges and Photography school should definitely have an entire course on business and marketing, just like they do for every other business on the planet. Same applies.
August 21st, 2010 at 7:20 am
Russ, for a moment step back and look at what you are doing objectively, by which I mean, imagine that you were an outside investor looking at your business.
Now think about what you said: "By reducing my prices I managed to stabilize my business and save it." You said earlier that you are charging less than half what you did in 2005, but let's make the maths easy and say you have reduced your prices by 50%. That means that to "stablize and save your business" you now need to be shooting nearly twice as much as you were 5 years ago, and that would still result in your having an empirical (let alone real terms) pay cut. This does not suggest to me that you have stabilized or saved your business, it suggests to me that you are hanging on for dear life. What is you next move to stablize and save the business? Do you cut your rates again? In another five years will you be shooting four times as much to achieve the same ends? That is not a sensible approach to business.
You talk about the recession having pushed 40% of established pros out of business. The reality is that the recession is only part of the story. Some of those businesses were dying anyway through natural wastage and structural inflexibility. Some have gone to the wall because they were overleveraged and when the banks came calling they couldn't repay. Yes the recession has caused the market to shrink, but only to a minor extent, by which we are talking a few percentage points. But even if it were a ten per cent shrinkage, that would still leave 90% of the market actively seeking the work that established pros supply.
Anecdotely there was a move towards Uncle Fred and his camera before the recession struck, and the experience of many in that period was that it was a bad move. The more educated market was starting to realise that if you wanted a quality product you were going to have to pay for it, and there was a shift back to pros that was stalled by the credit crunch.
Now look at what is known about all businesses in recession: weak companies fail, while lean and efficient companies expand very quickly out of recession. Why is this? It is because the greatest business growth ALWAYS comes off the back of recession, not boom.
Let's suppose that prior to the recession you had a local market share of 8%, with the remainder of the market being split between 9 other established photographers and the freebie brigade. According to the stats you provided, and using my figures, 3.6 (call it four) photographers have gone to the wall. That means the market is now split between you and 5 others, plus the freebies. Even if we allow the recession to shift more of the market towards the freebies, in reality you should now have a greater market share than you had previously - your order book should be starting to grow. But wait, it isn't. Why not? Because the single biggest mistake that businesses make when they see recession looming is that they cut all "unnecessary expenditure", and the first thing they cut is marketing and advertising. The result? The increased market share that they should be enjoying doesn't know that they exist. If they were lean and efficient they may stablize and hold on, often by cutting their prices and appealing to the lower end of the market. If they were not lean and efficient, then there is a good chance that their business will fail too, and their market share will be carved up among the ones that survive. But those businesses that do the opposite and increase their marketing and advertising budgets grow very quickly, because they have more of the market to themselves, and the market knows they are there.
Before you say that this is all rubbish, I trained as an economist before I got into photography (20 odd years ago), and much of my interest was on the behaviour of business in recession. When I saw this one coming, I put my money where my mouth is and tripled my marketing and advertising budget. There was a lag of about 9 or ten months, but the effect now is that I am turning good work away because I simply do not have the time to fit it in.
My area is not dissimilar to yours, the professional photography industry is being decimated, partly by the recession, and partly by the massive oversupply of "photographers" willing to do it for nothing because they think it is a glamourous career.
The point I was trying to make to you is that the established pros have a responsibility to promote and support their industry, and that includes helping those who are starting out to do things properly.
I may be wrong, but whatever industry a person is in, if they get to the stage that they are working twice as hard for less reward, and they can't abide the idea of helping out those who are trying to get started, they have reached a level of jadedness that suggests they should be thinking about moving on to something more fulfilling themselves.
August 21st, 2010 at 1:27 pm
You have made lots of incorrect comments/assumptions throughout your post.
1) All of the photographers in my town who survived have lowered their prices too. All of those who refused to lower their prices closed their studios.
2) All of the survivors have less income now than they had previously. Some by a lot less. I have trimmed my costs and managed to be at somewhere around 70% of what I was to making prior to the recession. My bookings are about the same. Some of my competitors are doing better than that, some worse.
3) My bookings are beginning to increase now, and I am beginning to raise prices, and my profit is increasing. I intend to continue this process as long as the market will support it. However, the minute I see things turning back the other way I won't hesitate to lower my prices in response. That's the way capitalism works. You cannot stick your head in the sand and refuse to lower your prices on principle.
4) The low end bargain photographers have gained the most recently. Some of them are very good photographers, and the public has figured this out. Some are also very good business people who fully understand price elasticity (something you obviously do not). They generally have no studio, only shoot on-location, have no advertizing costs, live in a low cost apartment with no family to support, need minimal equipment, and they can make as much profit as I do while charging 30% less than I do. My only real advantage is that I have 30 years of experience and there are still a few customers who feel more comfortable working with an experienced pro and meeting in a studio rather than a restaurant or in their personal residence. Some do like to meet in their homes, and I will accomodate them, of course.
I don't want to be rude, but you and all other photographers who want to survive have to get away from this notion that good business practices do not ever require price reductions, and that you can charge whatever want.
When the market shrinks, like it has around here, only those who truly understand marketing and free enterprise capitalism will survive. Any lesser understanding amounts to just wishful thinking, and the market will take care of that in a brutal fashion just like it has here.
Russ
August 22nd, 2010 at 12:34 am
You're confusing two very different reasons for doing things for free and ignoring a third. I agree that pro bono work is poor marketing. It does set the expectation for more freebies.
You're downplaying a very useful strategy for building a portfolio. It's part of the learning curve. Trading photos for free modeling time as you learn lighting is a good practice. Make your mistakes and get up to speed before you insist on your fee. WIthout the skill you'll quickly get a bad rep if you charge and can't deliver. Besides, barter is getting paid.
And sometimes you simply have to do favors for family. At least in families that believe in taking care of one another.
August 24th, 2010 at 1:50 pm
Why do you hate so much? If I'm a hobby photographer who chooses to share some of my work with others, should I charge those people anyway, just so somewhere out there, a photographer won't come in contact with that person and be expected to provide free photography for 13 of their closest friends' neighbors' bar mitzvahs? Someone bought me lunch one time, I don't expect now to walk into a restaurant and receive free food, or for that person to pay for a meal for me every time I see them. if I hold the door for someone walking into a building, they never demand that I follow them through the rest of their day holding all of their doors for them, since obviously because I was gracious once, I must be perfectly willing to just freely give the rest of my time as well. My God, you are an angry person, and people like you take the joy out of being kind or even having a hobby that one just likes doing for fun, without the pressures of sales and marketing. When was the last time you enjoyed taking a picture? Just pure enjoyment, taking a picture, being proud of it and being perfectly secure with showing the world and saying "this is what I have done". Reminds me of a person I work with who designs tattoos, but so far, hasn't made a solitary penny off of it, because he doesn't believe people should be able to look at his artwork without paying first, and can't find a site that will display the work of an unknown, but charge for the privilege of actually viewing the images. Let your work sell itself, let it speak for itself, and if it possesses one iota of merit or artistic value, you needn't worry about amateurs "undercutting" your sales. Be a professional, and act like one. This is juvenile.
August 25th, 2010 at 10:44 am
Dave,
I'm not sure who you are replying to, but I am not an angry person. I am a business person.
I don't have any problem with the hobby photographer who offers his work for free. When a client utilizes a hobby photographer, sometimes they will get good results and other times they will not. If they are willing to gamble, then they can always find someone willing to give it a go.
The photographers that have really hurt all of our businesses are the bargain photographers. The advent of low cost, high quality DSLRs have drawn lots of these types into the business. These are people who often possess a brand new photo school diploma, are single, live in a low cost apartments, and have no studio to pay for. That keeps their overhead costs rock bottom. But the real problem is that they are often very good photographers who have great portfolios. This is what is really hurting established pros.
This is forcing the entire photography business to change. The amount that the average photographer can charge is decreasing constantly. The survivors are the ones who change with it and cut costs and even lower their prices. The ones who don't, slowly lose busness until they go bankrupt.
You notice, I said 'average' photographer. I believe there will always be a few really great photographers who can and will hold their prices up in some markets.
But how many of us are in that camp? I certainly am not. My work is constant, very good but not great, I'm reliable, and I get along well with the clients. Does that mean I should hold my prices up and wait for the end? No, it means I am forced to change with the times.
I get a small premium for experience, but not much. The new crop of cients are smart. They are looking for lowest cost without sacrificing quality, and they realize that some of these new photographers are really good. So they search them out by looking at their portfolios and calling their references.
I believe the new bargain photographer is here to stay whether we established pros like it or not!
I will survive by making the best images I can, keeping my overhead as low as possible, living within my means, and by adjusting my prices as necessary.
I am not bitter or angry. This is free enterprise!
After all, who can be bitter about making a living, even a small one, by taking photographs? If I didn't need the income, I'd do it as a hobby myself!
Russ
August 26th, 2010 at 9:01 am
I am quite late to this party, but oh well! BG: I am a 23 year old wedding, product and advertising photographer with a marketing & journalism degree. I have been working in darkrooms and studios for most of my life as my parents dabbled in photography for many years, picking up skills which I highly value.
I love what I do, I love meeting clients and I have successfully pulled off an extremely successful print ad campaign which has sparked literally hundreds of leads and given me enough full time work (with most clients having paid booking deposits) till the end of 2012. This would not have been possible without a mixture of a few things: Business & moderate-level legal expertise (a hugely overlooked quality in creative industries), catchy, targeted marketing and my ability to showcase my work, a good portion of which has been done pro bono (with the clients paying for travel expenses). Now that I have that portfolio and experience, I charge just below market rate for a competitive advantage. Pro bono work should not be discounted. No, it is not professional, but someone has to start somewhere. I wouldn't do free work for anyone now, but I would fully encourage it for fresh graduates. This doesn't devalue your work, your self worth -- none of that emotional crap. It says to people "Yes, I'm passionate about my art and I will do anything to be good at it, even though I'll charge you in the future."
Another point that's been brought up is working alongside a pro as an alternative to working for free. This isn't always a viable option. When I finished high school, my parents decided to ditch their hobby and I wanted to get some work experience with a photographer.... Nobody wanted to give me a chance as they didn't want to jeopardize the quality of their work on location as they trained Miss Noob. That's fair enough too. From the other side of the fence, I have encouraged students and upcoming photographers to come on location with me to shoots and all they've done is muck around and use their experience as an ego trip.
As evidenced by statements made in this discussion, the photography industry, as with any industry, is pretty dog-eat-dog these days and you really have to fend for yourself. As a service provider and an artist, I'm here to impress my clients, not to impress other photographers. I'm good at my job, I work extremely hard and am highly passionate about it..... other newbies are fully welcome to that feeling. As long as I stay on top of my game, I don't have to worry about people stealing my business -- if they are, I'm not doing my job right.
August 26th, 2010 at 7:57 pm
Maria,
You are the new photographer I have been writing about.
You are good and you know it. You price yourself below me, and I am forced to respond in some fashion. Usually it means I have to reduce my prices to meet yours, since I've long ago trimmed all the fat out of my overhead.
I don't blame you, however, since you are doing exactly what I am doing; fighting to get your share of the market.
The photographers who don't understand this fight and don't learn learn to play this game will fail. And especially those who persist in the false belief that they don't ever have to reduce prices
Russ
August 27th, 2010 at 1:12 am
I read this article laughing and with some disappointment with this guy. Everyone does what makes them happy, no matter what their craft is. So what if someone wants to offer their work for free to build a clientele or a name for themselves, it doesn't have to mean that they are always going to do everything for free it just means its a starting point. Nobody I have EVER met has ever told me they hate free, and don't for one second tell me that you aren't the first in line to try something new for free, cus you'd be a liar. Wether its artwork, knitting, music, photography or poetry we all need to get our stuff out there for people to see and if they like it the first time, and come back for more (just like in a sample aisle at the supermarket) they are going to have to pay.
I think your BS article is your way of getting your opinion out to us FOR FREE and I for one am not coming back for seconds...free or not!
Thank you to all the people out there that love what they do so much that the occassional freebie isn't out of line.
If your that worried about being undercut...maybe go back to school and work on your art, then people will be more than willing to pay the asshole money for his art.
August 27th, 2010 at 4:48 am
Dear Russ, I agree with the reality that you are talking about; but there is only one point that you are missing: regarding your belief that "The photographers who don't understand this fight and don't learn to play this game will fail".
And that is: The photographers who do understand this fight and learn to play this game will also fail. Not in terms of losing business; that they might manage to save through cutting down prices etc. But in terms of end results. If they keep on this trend, eventually they will fade out because there will be so little or zero business output in the end. Its like they say, that the problem with running in a rat race is that even if you win, you're still a rat. It takes a little more than one article to understand this idea completely.
August 27th, 2010 at 8:43 am
HWZ,
Yes, except only some photographers really know how to play the game. Lots of the ones who lower their prices without using sound business practices will also fail. The 'game' is much bigger than just prices. It's everything combined.
The ones who will survive are the ones who can apply good business practices to weather the storm. When they come out the other side, there may be a chance to increase profits. On the other hand, if the exiting photographers are replaced with more budget photographers, well, that's where the market will stay.
Russ
August 27th, 2010 at 11:30 am
F.U.
It's MY camera... If I want to shoot pix and charge or shoot pix and give my pix away, it's MY choice.
Quit whining.
August 27th, 2010 at 11:59 am
Free Shooter,
You are obviously very immature. I hope you grow out of it someday.
August 27th, 2010 at 7:13 pm
Photojournalists debating wedding photographers debating fashion shooters debating stock contributors.
Disjointed. Like listening to a schizophrenic.
"Photographer" is generic term covering many genres, realities, trade-offs. Hello...?
August 28th, 2010 at 3:44 am
I do empathize about you losing business or having to cut down rates because of all these so called 'noobs'. but if u are losing out to these 'noobs', it means that u are a 'noob' urself.
Photography has changed..thanks to digital technologies. I remember started off as a kid with my first film SLR camera and how i got very much disappointed looking at my underexposed or blurred photos and the fact that it was almost impossible to go back to the same scene and re-shoot. Taking good photos those days require years of experience, dozen and dozens of films to get u there. Today, these co-called 'noobs' can simply view through the LCD or an attached laptop and readjust the exposure and recompose. To be frank, the photos shown in ur website can be easily taken by any of these 'noobs' given the same set of gears and lighting equipments u have.
don't believe me? take a stroll down Flickr and see for urself what these 'noobs' produced.
furthermore, we can even manipulate light with digital software now. so what if u know more about lighting than them?
the point is, not only u are competing with fellow professional photographers, u are also competing with these new amateurs and so called 'noobs'. photography has become a very popular hobby form all walks of life - cameras are flying off the shelves, photo sharing websites are blooming like mushrooms. we even have websites offering to sell ur photos for even $1! so, do expect more and more competition to come in ur way.
someone mentioned - u should go work as a pro's assistant to learn to shoot. why waste time dude?? the resources over the internet, books, magazines, workshops are almost unlimited. why learn from one pro photographer if u can learn from so many other pro photographers?
dont agree with me? go search youtube alone and see how much you can learn photoshoot and photoshop from there.
however, i believe that one thing remains unchanged - if people like ur works, they will be willing to pay for your expertise..regardless of your price. there are photographers who are even earning more than before..because they came out of their shells and saw those changes and make good use of them to their benefit.
August 28th, 2010 at 2:09 pm
@YSW - Your comments are insulting, photography has not changed, in order to produce great images, it still takes skill and imagination - not an LCD Screen and definately NOT software and that is where the bulk of the problems lay....
a photographer is not the owner of a camera, anyone can own a camera and they always have done, a photographer is an artist, a skilled person who earns their living converting light to an image, which is the meaning of 'photography' - 'Drawing with light'.
I shoot as much Film for myself and my clients as I do Digital but whatever I shoot, the images used come straight from the camera and NOT from some expensive piece of software because the moment you do that, it is NO LONGER A PHOTOGRAPH, it is simply an image...!
Now I don't disagree that cheaper digital cameras have introduced MORE people to photography, however, 90% of these are still producing 'snap shots' for their computers, MySpace, Facebook etc.
I stopped using Business Cards a few years ago and switched to 9x6 prints with my details at the base because people have forgotten what a high quality print looks like.. it works because:
(a) it is an example of my work,
(b) because people will NOT throw a nice print in the bin like they will a business card and
(c) they treat it more like a 'gift' rather than 'just' a picture.
I do work with young photographers, I won't work with 'noobs' as they appear to be called because the 'noobs' I have found are NOT interested in a career in photography, they are just interested in making a quick tax free '£' and I wonder how long it is before the IRS in the US and HMRC in the UK catch onto this black market tax evasion and start penalising them for their offences and demanding unpaid back tax.... not only are they denying the IRS and HMRC tax at the expense of other tax payers, but under-cutting other photographers, they are further reducing the amount of tax paid overall into the economy which does no one any good and it is partially THIS problem that helped lead to the current biggest recession the world has seen. The banks make a great scapegoat for the Governments and the Media, however as is seen in Greece where tax evasion is a way of life, this constant damage to industries will only end tears!
With over 30,000 people taking some form of formal education/degree in photography in the UK, less than 1% will ever earn a living from it - why? Because of market saturation, the appalling quality of work produced with little or no imagination etc... without an 'eye' for what they are shooting, whether they have a degree or not, a snap shot will only ever be a snap shot and not a photograph!
August 31st, 2010 at 10:08 pm
Great article! My thought is it's fine to do at least ONE free shoot with whatever kind of shoot you want to do (ONE for portraiture, ONE for editorial, whatever). That way when you ask for money, you can show that ONE shot to a potential client. You can't ask for money without showing anything!! BUT I agree, you shouldn't devalue the industry or yourself. Now if I can figure out HOW MUCH to charge...
September 1st, 2010 at 11:04 pm
great post, when I've done the occasional "free" photo/video shoot, I ALWAYS include an actual invoice stating what my services were and what the regular fee would be on a go forward. Doing this has worked out very well for me. Using an invoice shows professionalism and it's good to document it for business purposes.